[info]stewardess in [info]stewardess_fics

FIC: Ritual. SGA. John/Rodney. NC-17.

Title: Ritual
Author: Stewardess
Fandom: Stargate Atlantis
Pairing: John/Rodney
Rating: NC-17
Summary: After Rodney puts himself in danger again, John uses a shortcut to take him down. Spoilers for episodes up to and including Miller's Crossing. Warnings: see prompt. Word count 3,100.
Disclaimer: I own nothing but a plushy cat.


They were visiting, for the second time, via a stargate unknown to Elizabeth, a planet with… actually, Rodney didn't know anything about this world other than the name of its people, the Bynar. Lorne's team had come the first time, and Rodney had missed the briefing that morning because Radek had begged him to come to the lab.

But he had overheard in the mess Katie talking about the initial reconnaissance, when an Atlantean botanist discovered the Bynar practiced… siviculture? They grew trees with a berry containing a high concentration of C8H10N4O2. Nothing other than the promise of psychoactive fruit could have kept Rodney standing for nearly an hour, listening to the priestess drone on, in what passed for a Bynar place of worship.

John had volunteered Ronon to participate in the ritual, which was multi-purpose: appease the Bynar ancestors, give thanks for the harvest, acknowledge the new trading partnership, and show off the sheer garments worn only on special occasions.

Ronon, however, lying flat on his back on what looked uncomfortably like a stone slab Pre-Colombian Central Americans might have used when they were in a heart removing mood, was dressed normally, in something homespun and opaque. He and Rodney and John and the other Atlanteans had temporarily put aside their electronic and mechanical devices out of respect—"respect" as usual meaning giving in to an alien people's fear of advanced technology.

The priestess, who was old but vigorous, at last grew louder and more animated, potentially a sign the ceremony was ending. Finally. They could hand over medical supplies in exchange for the berries, and return to Atlantis. Or were they required (again) to break bread with the locals?

"Breaking" was appropriate, because it appeared from an earlier meal that leavening was unknown to the Bynar. Not even naturally occurring yeast? The Bynar didn't seem to have booze, either. Which came first in primitive societies, yeast for alcohol production, or yeast for leavening bread? He knew this… Jeannie! Of course. A few years earlier, his sister had served him an impenetrable barley "meat" loaf, lecturing him on the history of the earliest large scale grain cultivation—of barley—to make…

Beer. "Beer!" Rodney yelled incongruously in warning, but it was too late: the priestess raised a huge and until then unseen knife, plunging it down towards Ronon's chest.

Rodney reached for the gun that wasn't on his belt. John gripped his wrist.

"It's okay, Rodney," John said.

It was okay, because Ronon was sitting up and examining with professional interest the neat, shallow cut the Bynar priestess had made on his chest.

"Oh," Rodney said.

John released him. "You missed the briefing."

"That's not my fault, Radek begged me–"

"You didn't listen to me on the jumper on the way over," John said.

"What? I was, absolutely," Rodney said, although now he could remember John saying, Rodney, are you listening? when he maybe possibly hadn't. "I might have been distracted, but I would never ignore you, are you kidding?"

John looked at him. Rodney stopped talking. For a few seconds.

"After that, I could use a drink that suppresses the central nervous system," Rodney said.

"Liquor is unknown here," Ronon said as they left the decaying stone structure, following the Bynar back to their village.

"I know," Rodney said. "I ate the flat bread, emphasis on flat."

Ronon said, "What does that have to do with–"

"It's going to be in my large intestine for weeks."

"You almost screwed up the ceremony," John said when Ronon had moved out of ear-shot—which was many, many meters away.

Rodney tried to switch off the communicator he wasn't wearing, then said, "No, Colonel, I didn't." The locals, particularly the priestess, had looked amused by his outburst, not offended.

John still appeared to disagree, because Rodney saw him with the priestess later, probably making a completely unwarranted apology.

The rest of the day, John didn't speak to him except for the minimum. Dial the gate. Reports due at sixteen hundred. Hands off the berries, McKay. John knew how much Rodney hated the silent treatment, which made Rodney hate it even more. Which John also knew.




When John came to his quarters that night at eleven thirty, Rodney was more relieved than he was willing to admit. It didn't stop him from mouthing off, however.

"I'm not in the mood for hot make-up sex," Rodney said. "Any other sort of hot sex will be fine." To prove his sincerity, he sat up on his bed and closed his laptop.

John didn't sit on the bed but remained standing.

Rodney sighed, and slid across the bed until his feet touched the floor. "Fine, fine, we'll play that game."

"Which game?" John hadn't changed after the mission. He was in full gear.

"You know." Rodney was still uncomfortable with referring to it directly. "The one where you say On your knees." He waved his fingers in front of his mouth, indicating what came next.

John looked calculating, which was new, and oddly alarming. "Why should we do that?"

"Because it works," Rodney said impatiently. John would feel better afterward. He would feel better afterward.

"Why does it work for you?" John said.

It took a huge effort for Rodney to remain sitting on the bed while John was being deliberately annoying. They had already talked about this, months ago, before the first time they played at dominance and submission.

Rodney was usually all for talking, but after picking a safeword, and telling John what was off limits, there was nothing more to say about it. Unless it wasn't working for John any longer? Or was John actually stooping to withholding sex to punish him? Rodney wasn't going to play along with that.

"Because it's like that ceremony today. It's familiar." Rodney made reassuring shapes in the air with his hands. "And there are orgasms," he added, in case John was forgetting that point.

When John frowned, Rodney regretted mentioning the Bynar.

"If you're still angry about my disrupting the primitive performance art–"

"Performance art?" Understanding crossed John's face.

"Yes, yes! It was only a ritualistic, er, ritual. Didn't accomplish anything, but everyone was happy with its, you know, intent. Purpose." Rodney smiled, sensing a blowjob in his near future.

"On your knees," John said.

Trying not to smirk, Rodney knelt in front of John. When John bent over him, Rodney put his hands behind his back so John could slip on old-school metal handcuffs. Rodney breathed in, pressing his face against the buttoned fly of John's black BDUs.

Unexpectedly, John gripped the hair at the base of Rodney's skull and yanked his head back, exposing his throat.

Rodney said, "Ow!" but it came out hoarse, muted. He hadn't realized his hair was long enough to grab.

"Holding your head in this position compresses your vagus nerve," John said.

Rodney grunted in acknowledgement. The nerve ran from his brain to… all over the place. Lungs? Heart. Intestines. Oh, hell, the bread. Tack on another week.

"It affects breathing. Speech. And your gag reflex," John said with irritating calm. He moved to stand at Rodney's side, the reason immediately apparent when he forced Rodney's head further back.

Rodney squeezed out a whine. He'd felt John's hard cock against his cheek for only seconds before John had grabbed his hair and forced his head away. By this time, John usually had his fly open and was slapping Rodney's face with his cock.

"I am still angry," John said. "You tried to draw on unarmed civilians."

Crap. If John was going to make a military discipline thing out of what was only a social faux pas, then Rodney was done. He'd give up on the Air Force boyfriend sex and cozy up to his laptop tonight, no problem. But–

"Knife," Rodney wheezed in his defense.

"It didn't have an edge, except at the tip," John said. "You should have known there was no threat when I didn't react. Unless you think your reflexes are faster than mine now?"

Great, John was making a military thing out of it. Next—maybe—John would accuse him of ignoring the chain of command. Which could actually be hot, but not like this, when the cuffs were scraping Rodney's wrists, he could only croak words out, and no one was naked. Was his gag reflex really suppressed? John should check.

Rodney tried something that had worked spectacularly once before. "I'm sorry, Sir." Wait, was he supposed to refer to himself in the third person?

"So am I, Rodney."

It was not the response Rodney wanted. He tried to squirm, just enough to show he was getting physically uncomfortable, but not enough to put a stop to things, because he hadn't given up all hope of getting a cock in his mouth. He looked up pleadingly at John. Not that he could look anywhere else at the moment.

"I hoped I wouldn't have to take any shortcuts, but today was too much," John said.

Rodney exhaled heavily when John eased his grip, letting Rodney's head up slightly.

"What's that?" Rodney squawked.

Stupid question. It was a huge knife, and John was holding it inches from Rodney's face.

"John, seriously… did you get that from the priestess?" Rodney was too alarmed to enjoy the sensation of reduced compression on his windpipe.

"Yes."

"Then it doesn't have an edge," Rodney said, trying for triumphant, settling for relieved.

"This one does. It's an original. One the Bynar used when their ritual ended a little differently."

Rodney squinted, trying to see. John had to be bluffing.

"She wouldn't give you something that valuable, not even for antibiotics."

"I gave her my Leatherman for it."

"The one Ford gave you on your birthday?" Rodney said, shocked.

John forced his head back again. Rodney got the hint. He'd never had to work so hard for sex in his life.

John let his head come up, enough for Rodney to see John was holding the knife to his throat.

"Tesla," Rodney said immediately. When John didn't release him, Rodney said, "Tesla!" again, louder.

"I remember your safeword, Rodney. We're not playing that game right now."

"John, look, I know we never talked about knives, because, well, knives, obviously not something I'm into–"

John stroked Rodney's neck with the edge of the knife. Rodney nearly pissed his pants. He felt angry, and betrayed, but mostly angry. Furiously angry. And completely incapable of movement. He breathed shallowly to remain as still as possible.

"Kolya," Rodney said.

"I know," John said softly. "Like I said, a shortcut. He laid the groundwork. If anything will get you down in a hurry… Well. It's this."

Why not the usual, Rodney fumed silently. The smell of John in his gear after a mission, getting on his knees, being "forced" to suck John's cock, calling John Sir… all of that worked just fine to get Rodney into a submissive mood. There was no need–

Rodney felt the knife dig in. "We are so breaking up—I mean, that is, if we're going together? John!"

He had no idea what had gotten into John. It couldn't be post traumatic stress disorder, not now, not after everything that had happened to them in the Pegasus Galaxy. If John was going to snap, he would have snapped ages ago.

Logic. That was the key. Think it through logically. It wasn't PTSD, and it wasn't insanity because John was clearly in control of himself. At least not ordinary insanity. Maybe John had been exposed to something on the Bynar world, like that damned glowing fungus. At least John wasn't holding a whale to his throat.

"I think you should go to the infirmary," Rodney said. "Get scanned. I'll go with you. I should get scanned. Everyone should get scanned." The knife pressed in harder. "Jesus Christ, there's a carotid artery there, in case you didn't know!"

John didn't speak.

Rodney needed to swallow, but the blade was in the wrong place for the motion. If he ended up drooling, then he didn't care about the consequences, he was going to get even—he'd never eat dinner with John again, never talk to him, definitely not have sex with him. Not for a month, at least.

"Okay, I get it," Rodney said, trying to sound as if he got it. "You were mad, you wanted to make your… your point, and… John, just no, you wouldn't cut a man's throat, I know you wouldn't, well, maybe in Afghanistan, if you had to, but you didn't, because you had guns. Damn it, John, I know you wouldn't even threaten a man this way, not in cold blood! So this has to be some kind of joke, a prank gone wrong, and I am not buying it."

"Wallace bought it," John said.

"Wallace, president of Devlin Medical Wallace? What are you saying, that you–"

"Actually, I had him with the pictures of Madison. But then he got cold feet."

"Wait, you, you…" Rodney fell silent, remembering Wallace in the body bag, the Wraith rejuvenated, John not looking him in the eye.

"Presented the situation," John said. "Told him it could be fast, or slow. He chose fast. The Wraith."

John wouldn't do that, threaten to kill a man. For Rodney's sister. For Rodney. John wouldn't, right?

"You're… you're not a bug?" Rodney asked.

"No, Rodney. Just me."

Rodney's words dried up, his brain too busy processing. He believed it, because he knew John had been one hundred percent himself when the Wallace thing had happened, so…

His situation was terrifying. If he looked at it objectively. But what was genuinely scaring him was that he didn't know what John wanted.

And John wanted something from him. Badly. Enough to hold a razor-sharp knife to his throat.

His legs were numb from kneeling for so long. He wasn't sure he could stand if he tried. His shoulders ached, his wrists burned, and his throat was wet, as if…

It was an enormous relief when he realized he'd been going at it wrong. It wasn't a puzzle he had to solve. It wasn't a test. That wasn't what John wanted from him. It was okay for him not to know.

"I don't understand," Rodney said, looking up at John.

"I'm not going to watch you get blown away because you won't manage your fear," John said, staring directly into his eyes. "Because you won't trust me."

Rodney could totally see it now. He'd overreacted to the knife, gone for a gun, and Christ how many times did a person have to watch Silverado before he figured out how badly that always ended?

He should have trusted John. John wouldn't let a member of the team get stabbed. John wouldn't let anyone hurt him. John had threatened a man for him. No. Really, honestly? John had killed Wallace. For him.

This wasn't about screwing up trading opportunities or military discipline. It was about John wanting him to stay alive.

"I'm sorry," Rodney said. "I won't do it again."

John relaxed his grip, still holding Rodney's hair loosely. He moved the knife a few inches away. Rodney could see blood on it.

"There's a problem. I don't know if I can ever be sure," John said. He sounded so fucking tired.

Assuming his legs still worked, Rodney could have stood up at that moment. He didn't, because he knew what John wanted, because John had just told him: absolute certainty that Rodney trusted him.

Rodney could do it. Could give him that. He straightened slightly, slowly, pain flooding through his folded legs, and bent down, until his mouth touched the flat of the knife John still held. He kissed it.

"Oh, good boy," John said. "Good boy, Rodney." John had called him that before, but never with so much rough approval in his voice it forced water out of Rodney's eyes.

"May I–"

John didn't wait for him to finish. He put the knife down, unbuttoned his pants, and gripped Rodney's head.

Rodney was sure he couldn't stand now. He was helpless, arms behind his back, John's hands pressed tight over his ears. When John began fucking his mouth, it was perfect. John keeping him steady so he wouldn't get dizzy from his head snapping back and forth, John's cock hard and swollen on his tongue, Rodney's lips already burning from the stretch.

John came quickly, without warning. Rodney swallowed his come, greedily sucking up all traces, until John pulled away.

"Please," Rodney said desperately. He had almost come in his pants.

John sat heavily on the floor. He held his hand over Rodney's crotch. Rodney looked down, and thought he had never seen anything hotter than John's hand not quite touching him.

"Get those knees apart," John said.

Rodney somehow spread his legs, pain twisting through him.

When John unzipped Rodney's pants and gripped his cock, Rodney imagined what he looked like right then, kneeling, legs spread, arms locked behind him, and, most of all, John's hand on him.

"So fucking hot," John said. "Come for me."

Rodney did, yelling, feeling no pain anywhere, feeling only John's hand.

John unlocked the handcuffs, helped Rodney to the bed. He eased Rodney's clothes off, rubbed his arms and legs until the fiery throbbing of returning blood eased, and washed the neat, shallow cut just below Rodney's Adam's apple. John brought him a glass of water, holding it to his lips until he drank it down. Then John undressed, and spooned behind him, sometimes sleeping, sometimes grinding against his ass, until they were both hard again.

When John fucked him, it wasn't boy and Sir any longer, it was Rodney and John, but when John gently stroked Rodney's throat, Rodney came immediately, moaning as John fucked him through it.

Exhausted, Rodney was only half-aware of John's orgasm. He let John roll him onto his side, planting his head on John's chest when it was offered. He dozed, almost too tired to sleep, while John's hands possessively skimmed over him.

He was still awake to hear John say, "You can really surprise me, McKay."

"Well, of course," Rodney said, and slept.




Notes: 1) C8H10N4O2 is caffeine. 2) Ignore everything I said about the vagus nerve. 3) I lifted the name Bynar from Star Trek: The Next Generation.

Thanks to [info]anatsuno and [info]cesare for improving my steering!

Prompt: [info]telesilla said,"I want some seriously kinky SGA porn in which either John or Rodney brings the other down hard using either heavy pain or heavy humiliation or—ideally—both. And oh man, so many bonus points if it's Rodney—still himself: all pushy and stubborn right up to the point where he's not any more—on the bottom."

Comments

Oooh, yes, flows even better and -- yes. Much amplified yay HOTNESS THANK YOU. Nggh! LOVE.
This is a story I really enjoyed visualizing while I was writing. ^^
I'll just be over here incoherently gurgling at the HOT. Wow.
Thank you for your help! Since I see Rodney as a top with John, this was quite the IC challenge.
*flails* Oh, wow, that was seriously intense, and the setup made so much sense for them! Beautiful.
Thank you! ^^ I knew it would turn out intense, because I couldn't see anything minor getting Rodney that far down.
Oh, oh my. I think I just nicked my head on the table while writhing around from your fine, hot story.

Rodney kisses the knife. John says "Good boy, Rodney."

Excuse me while I clear the furniture away a bit further so I can writhe safely.
I think my "research" is paying off.

Um, were you under the table? Are there pictures? :D
As always, your writing is always worth the reading, even if I don't know the characters or what they look like, or the backstory. You make it very hot indeed.
You haven't met John's thigh holster? Oh no!! I'm glad you enjoyed it!
I've never seen the show. You could post a couple pics if you want :)))
Black BDUs. Yum!

Oh goddamn, that's the stuff! You totally delivered and I loved the set up and the point John was actually trying to make. And your Rodney voice is totally awesome, spot on!

Thank you! *cuddles fic and loves it and hugs it*
I'm glad you enjoyed it! My bunny was the knife. :) Weirdly, this may be the first BDSM scene I've written.
OMG Loved it.
Thank you kindly! :)
This is wonderful. What I loved the most was John's reason. It wasn't to dominate, but to protect. That hit a big button for me.
It eventually hit a big button for Rodney. :)
What I think really punched this one up for me is the fact that John Ignored Rodney's Safeword. O_O I mean, you just don't do that. Like, ever. The fact that John did it anyway says to me that he thought this issue was important, that getting through to Rodney was worth jeopardizing their relationship. He's willing to lose Rodney, or at least to have Rodney be unwilling to ever go down for him again (which I would think would be a significant possibility -- BDSM is all about trust, and when a top has ignored your safeword once.... :/ ) in order to make this lesson stick and (in John's mind at least) have Rodney be safer when they're on missions.

The knife thing was hot and all, but that [points up] is really what made this work for me. And I wouldn't mind seeing a sequel where they work through that issue.

Good job.

Angie
John showed up without a plan. Rodney inadvertently gave him an opening. Or maybe not inadvertently.

When people are "performing" a bdsm scene, there are many layers, and it's the ones we don't pay attention to that may be really working for us. In my story, Rodney started doing bdsm scenes with John for the hot sex, but it was much more than that for both of them. It was about trust.

So I thought it might be interesting for John to use a bdsm scene to make a point about trust to Rodney. And yep it risked their entire relationship. My ending doesn't allow for a return to bdsm play any time soon, I think. It also doesn't guarantee that Rodney won't wake up in the morning royally pissed off.

(Anonymous)

I have a...rather large problem with the fact that Rodney said his safe word and John didn't respect it. In no situation is that alright; it devalues the safe word and betrays the trust of the person saying it. That really took me out of the story and I unfortunately couldn't enjoy the rest of it.

--Xela-fic
In my fictional John's view, they weren't participating in bdsm play, so the safeword was irrelevant. It was a betrayal of trust, though, absolutely, because he used the bdsm scenario to get Rodney into a vulnerable position.

A dom doesn't rely on a safeword only. That would be dangerous, because a sub may not be able to get it out. My fictional John knows the physical and verbal signs that Rodney has reached his limits. If Rodney had reacted differently to the knife (weeping, cringing), John wouldn't have proceeded (regardless of whether he was "playing by the rules"), because his goal was not to break Rodney, but to get through to him.

In some D/s relationships, the couple negotiate not to have safewords, or make ignoring them an option. That's not something I would ever do, but I don't think we can say that in no situation is it all right. My comment above to angiepen has more of my thoughts on this.

(Anonymous)

Yes, in some D/S relationships, there is no safeword. That's negotiated before hand and understood. Sometimes, when you're bound and, say, gagged, you can't use a safeword; there can be other ways to 'safe word', like a signal or a specific kind of movement, or the understanding that there's no safeword. All of these things are negotiated before hand. I was also commenting in the vein of your fic, where the couple had agreed upon a safe word and the implications of that world.

But if there IS a safeword, then you cannot ignore it. The play started, obviously Rodney thought the safe word would stop it. It doesn't matter if John knew Rodney hadn't reached his limits, he still said it. It also doesn't matter that it went beyond a BDSM for sex thing, that John was trying to prove a real life point. Ignoring a safe word for whatever reason is unsafe and unconscionable. It doesn't matter what John's goal was, or what he was trying to accomplish. The safeword is never irrelevant.

I can understand what you were trying to do, but to just blatantly ignore the safe word just...I can't get over that. I understand that it's your world and you can have it play out as you want, but still, as someone who has been and is a part of that world, I can't get over that. Even if the outcome is positive or productive.
I understand why you find it impossible to get past (there are hundreds of things that can throw me out of a story, some as small as a misspelled word), but I hope my fiction (or anyone else's fiction) is understood not to be a bdsm instruction manual. In real life, I would refuse to accept a submissive who didn't want a safe word. I would assume he or she needed a level of sadism I cannot provide. I would also never disregard a safeword. My personal experiences with bdsm, however, aren't relevant to the story, which is a "what if" scenario: what if John's fear for Rodney's life grew great enough that he deliberately pushed Rodney to an edge, and how would Rodney react? A comparable scenario would be the parent who snoops through a teenage child's personal belongings because of suspected drug use.
nuh-uh flail

*whimper*
I love whimpering. :)

(Anonymous)

I'm with the person above who was disturbed by the safe word issue. I can see your reasoning for why it happened, and the whole fic was very well written, but it jerked me right out of the story and I found it difficult to enjoy the rest.

For me it wasn't just the fact that John ignored the safeword, but also the way Rodney reacted afterwards. Realising that John wants Rodney to be safe is one thing, but what John does here is a rather spectacular betrayal of the trust Rodney has placed in him. To me personally that is the bigger issue, and the fact that Rodney validates what John did with his acceptance (kissing the knife, assuring John of his trust etc) feels like it goes beyond BDSM and starts skirting the edges of abuse, where the abused partner is so dominated they accept their treatment as something they deserve or something they can't change.

It's weird but I wouldn't really have a problem with reading this scenario if the dominant partner wasn't portrayed in such a... sympathetic light, you know? I mean, I read far more disturbing stuff than this on a regular basis, but this fic struck a chord somehow. It leaves the characters with an interesting set of problems, and a sequel dealing with them would be fascinating.

Hope that made sense and wasn't too boring, feel free to ignore if it was :) It's definately the sign of good writing when it makes you think, even if you didn't actually enjoy the story.

Fitz
Absolutely makes sense.

It's interesting that another story written for this prompt also has reader comments about John's behavior seeming abusive. Also interesting: that author and I employed the same setup, John motivated by concern for Rodney's well-being or safety.

My job as narrator would have been a lot easier if I had written the story from John's POV, but the prompt, to me, required focusing on Rodney. If I write a follow-up (dang that angiepen!), it will have to be John's take.

I think both this story and the other inspired by the prompt are running into a wall because of the improbabilities of SGA canon, especially when combined with McShep.

If John was not a character on a sci-fi TV show, he would have taken Rodney off the team eons ago. No officer would keep a team member (no matter how brilliant) who consistently falls apart under fire. Nor can I buy that canon John would keep a lover on his team, particularly after how he handled Teyla's situation. He would never endanger the team that way, since he would constantly end up in situations where he had to choose between his lover and the team.

So, prior to the events of this story, I had to believe two impossible things. If I write a follow-up, I would have to address both problems.

What I think does fit canon, though, is John choosing to do something wildly against the rules, and highly likely to land him in serious trouble, for unselfish reasons. We've seen him shoot a superior officer, talk Wallace into committing suicide, and more. Every time John does something like that, his motives are always "good." Canon John is always sympathetic when he does bad things. :)

(Anonymous)

Hmm.. I see what you mean regarding John not keeping Rodney on his team, but if this was "real life" (and let's face it, SGA is not very real-life compliant) Rodney would really never have been on Johns team in the first place. Highly trained soldiers never take highly strung, out of shape, undertrained civilians on dangerous military ops with them (at least I would hope they don't!)

I have read one other story inspired by this prompt, don't know if thats the one you were referring to, and I didn't find that one abusive at all. What bothered me about this one was not really Johns actions (although as you know, in any safe BDSM environment they would be considered dangerous) but more the overall tone of "John knows best". I just can't see how John could think that the way to get Rodney to trust him in the field is to completely betray Rodneys trust in the bedroom. He takes something that should be enjoyable and rewarding for the both of them and turns it into a terrifying object lesson. Now that (in real life) would be a major deal-breaker for many people. What I couldn't get past in the fic was not so much Johns actions, because it is just fiction and I neither want nor need my favourite characters to be paragons of virtue, but rather the overall tone that because John had Rodneys safety and best interests at heart, it's all ok. To use your parent/child analogy from further up the page, it's like a parent beating the crap out of their child to stop them fighting in the schoolyard. It may have the desired effect, but that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do, or that you're not a deeply shitty person for doing it (general you of course, not you personally). For Rodney to just accept this type of unsettling behavior from John without any kind of censure is where the feeling of abuse comes in (for me). I just can't help feeling that John needs to experience some consequences from Rodney, trust has to work both ways after all. You mentioned that your ending left open the possibility that Rodney may be angry in the morning, or that BDSM may be off the cards from now on. I have to say I didn't really see that at all (although that may just be my interpretation). I think if that was more evident I wouldn't have had a problem with the fic at all.

Reading the other comments on this page, I don't really think it needs a non-con warning (although different people have wildly different ideas of what "non-con" actually entails) but maybe some kind of "look out, unsafe BDSM and possible triggering issues within" warning? I don't know, it's hard to categorize something like this. It's also your story, and you don't have to do anything that you don't feel is applicable, but you've got some really polarised responses here. :)

Fitz

(Anonymous)

Forget to mention...

"I think both this story and the other inspired by the prompt are running into a wall because of the improbabilities of SGA canon, especially when combined with McShep."

I can't speak for anybody else, but the improbabilities of SGA canon really had no part in my reaction to the fic. Whether you're writing fic for something as daft as SGA or as realistic as a Ken Loach kitchen sink drama (or Lost or 24 or Supernatural or Shakespeare or Care Bears or My Little Pony (shudder), anything really) for that matter, the issue at hand is the same. One of the great things about SGA IMO, is that its fandom is so diverse when it comes to subject matter and tone. There are so many different styles of fic out there, many of them (in fact probably the majority of them) don't really use canon as anything other than a jumping off point. I mean, I love SGA, but I would be the first to admit it's not exactly the most ground-breaking, in-depth or even well written show out there. Luckily we have fandom itself to make up the gap ;)

Fitz (who has given herself disturbing mental images of BDSM practising Care Bears...)
The comments don't seem polarized, since they cover a lot of ground: hot, funny, unsettling, and wrong. :)

I assume the folks who find it hot have the canon "John may be a pirate wily rule-breaker but he's still a good man" in their heads while reading, and his actions in the story aren't enough to disrupt it for them.

The problem with warnings is that I cannot anticipate what a reader brings with them, and the only way to guarantee a painless read is to put so much in the summary everyone is spoiled. For instance, I could have summarized the story as, "John ignores Rodney's safeword, and holds a knife to his throat, but don't worry, the ending is fluffy." There was a huge multi-fandom debate on fic warnings in December 2006 you may find interesting. See metafandom during that time period.

Feedback such as "what John does here is not the John I know and love!" is helpful. I may not agree with it, but it makes sense. My view of John as a combat veteran who is more comfortable using a physical act (including a violent one) than words to get his point across is not going to be shared by everyone. But criticism that a dom ignoring a sub's safeword is a bad thing in general implies my story is magic and can make it happen in reality, causing a real person harm. That does not make sense to me.

One moment selected as "abusive" was Rodney kissing the knife. A submissive kissing a token of submission, such as a collar, is a pretty mundane bdsm ritual, though. Criticism of wolfshark's story also focused on something very common, a dom calling a submissive a slut. I assumed the prompt's wording, "John or Rodney brings the other down hard using either heavy pain or heavy humiliation" was sufficient to get across they wouldn't be tickling each other with feathers (though for me that would be about the worst thing ever). But what "bring down hard" and "heavy pain" means to me (or Telesilla) and what it means to everyone else is not going to be the same thing. There is nothing I can do about that; I cannot guarantee someone won't be offended.

(Anonymous)

The problems I had with this story are not really the ones that you have outlined above. In fact I agree with most of your points entirely. I totally agree with the characterization of John as "John may be a wily rule-breaker but he's still a good man". That is exactly how I see him in canon and how I prefer to see him in fic. What I also see is a man who is quite capable of making errors in judgement and dealing with it. And I certainly would never think that anything written in fic has ANY bearing on reality at all. That implies a certain level of stupidity on my part that I would hope is far from the truth. I also agree with your definitions of "bring down hard" and "heavy pain". The kissing of the knife etc was something that in a BDSM scene would be entirely appropriate and not abusive at all. I have been active in the BDSM community for going on twenty years now and all these things are very familiar to me. It was not the actions in the fic that I had issue with but rather the characterisations, and really more specifically the REactions of RODNEY than of John. I can totally see John acting like that (in the context of the fic). Doesn't make what he did "right" but as I stated before, I don't need or want characters to always be paragons of virtue. In fact, "perfect" characters are one of the things that would stop me reading a fic. What I could not see was Rodney accepting it without any repercussions for John. This is probably because I am more interested in the characterization issues than the "OMG hot sex!!!" side of things (although the hot sex side is pretty terrific in of itself).

Thats what put me off your fic basically, not any misconceptions over what BDSM is, or disagreement as to who canon John is. It's the Rodney side of things that put me off. I personally would rather see a BDSM scene go realistically off the rails and have the characters deal with it than for it to carry straight on to the hot sex part(and how weird does that make me!) Maybe I should just lighten up and enjoy the porn :)

I reread wolfshark's story after seeing your comment, and I personally could never have a problem with it, really enjoyed it in fact. I've called more people "slut" over the years than I've had hot dinners, as you say, it's not uncommon in BDSM circles. The very wording of the prompt gives away the fact that this will not be a light and fluffy fic, and to be honest I've read far more down and dirty stories than that one without seeing any dissention.

RE warnings, I read the metafandom discussion back when it was current, it was quite interesting as I recall. I also agree that warnings are a bit of a hot button in fandom, there will never be total agreement as to what needs a warning and what doesn't. Some people don't even warn for death and rape, which a lot of readers would consider essential. I can see why some people would have a problem, but for me the only thing that actually "bothers" me is bad writing and/or wonky characterization, and again, it's all subjective so you (again, general you, not you specifically) can't really warn for it. What I think is appalling OOC dreck will probably have dozens of glowing "OMG rite more!!!" reviews at fanfiction.net.

At the end of the day it's your fic and your comm, you can do what the hell you like with it :)

Finally (I promise!) I would just like to apologise for droning on at you at length. I don't even feel that strongly about the subject, but I've got some rare free time and once I start talking about something I can't seem to shut up about it. Combined with all the spelling and grammar mistakes I've just found with spellcheck... Let's just say that thank god I've got a secretary with excellent editing skills IRL or I would never get anything finished!

Fitz

(Anonymous)

"Tesla," Rodney said immediately. When John didn't release him, Rodney said, "Tesla!" again, louder.

"I remember your safeword, Rodney. We're not playing that game right now."


I stopped reading right about there. I did read the prompt, but this needs a non-con warning.
I'd classify it as non-con if what happened next was John having sex with Rodney while threatening Rodney with a knife (or using any kind of threat). That is not what happens next, however. There isn't any non-consensual sex in the story.

(Anonymous)

There may not be non-consensual sex, but there's non-consenual bdsm. And if you're not willing to classify as bdsm, then there's non-consensual abuse. Non-con is more than just rape.
It's my understanding that a non-con warning, as currently used in fiction headers, apply only to forced sexual acts. Physical assault, robbery, and murder are non-consensual, but non-con warnings aren't used for them.

You may have broken my brain, you know.

Umm...excuse me. I have to go...do a thing...

*wanders off, muttering about kittens*

Re: You may have broken my brain, you know.

No, not the kittens!!!
You know, I didn't read this when you first posted it, because handcuffs and knives and dom/sub does nothing for me. But after your recent post I wanted to see what all the fuss was about. And seriously? This is some of the funniest shit I've read in a long time. Rodney is hysterical in this. I love him. If he was this funny in the show I could probably watch it. BRAVO!

PS: can I get a non-consentual smartass warning here?
Rodney is frequently used for comic relief on the show, but it irks me that there has been no change to the shtick after four seasons. *mourns*

I'm glad you enjoyed the humor. You are the first person who commented on that. ^^
Wait. You aren't, since Telesilla and others said they enjoyed Rodney's voice and the dialog.

*needs more coffee*
Well, yes, but I commented on it almost exclusively because, while I can apprectiate the hot, as soon as the dom/sub stuff comes into a fic I just switch off a little. Not because it offends me or anything, but it's like, I just don't get the appeal I guess. If someone pulled a knife on me in an intimate moment I'd either laugh or break their fingers.
I would plot their death. :D
Oh wow. Great Rodney. Actually, great John too. Funny and hot and thank you.
You are welcome!