Tweak

InsaneJournal

Tweak says, "You gave me crabs!"

mysteryfan (mysteryfan) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-09-25 14:23:00

Entry tags:

char: batgirl/cassandra cain, char: batgirl/oracle/barbara gordon, char: batman/bruce wayne, char: robin/red hood/jason todd, char: spoiler/robin/batgirl/steph brown, creator: andersen gabrych, creator: cam smith, creator: pete woods, title: detective comics

Jason's Eighteenth Birthday

From Detective #790 and War Drums TPB

tags: title: Detective Comics, char: Batman/Bruce Wayne, char: Batgirl/Cassandra Cain, char: Oracle/Batgirl/Barbara Gordon, char: Spoiler/Robin/Batgirl/Stephanie Brown, char: Red Hood/Robin/Jason Todd, creator:Anderson Gabrych, creator: Pete Woods, creator: Cam Smith

(Post a new comment)

trelas
2009-09-25 07:49 pm UTC (link)

I really love that issue as it simply a touching story with Bruce reflecting about his own past mistakes and communicating with the only member of the Batclan who was as broken as he was and thus could understand his point the best.

It's also kind of sad as I thought that this story provided a very strong indication on how they would have handled Steph's situation and the miscommunication between her and Bruce leading to War Games before Wynningham, with the apparent support of Didio, managed to cram through the idea of having Steph be a Robin, which really disrupted the dynamics and build-up towards the crossover.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

mysteryfan
2009-09-25 08:04 pm UTC (link)

I think it's very touching, too. I liked reading it. Still in the middle of reading the entire War Drums/Games arc, but I really liked this part.

I wonder, too, if he's communicating with Cass in part because she's not a Robin. Like, perhaps, being around another of his sons/Robins would be more than he could deal with right now. (And also, to me, he and Cass have a lot in common with the way(s) they communicate and deal/don't deal with things.) Also, it's interesting to me that apparently, nobody's really talked to her (or to Steph--we learn in War Games) about Jason up to now--even though Tim and Dick have talked with each other about Jason, and it's a really nice moment that Bruce's finally ready to 'introduce' her to Jason.

That he can admit certain things and open up to her and possibly get a little support.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

trelas, 2009-09-25 08:17 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-25 08:24 pm UTC

trelas, 2009-09-25 09:19 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-25 09:25 pm UTC

trelas, 2009-09-25 09:42 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-25 09:46 pm UTC

sistermagpie, 2009-09-25 10:41 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-25 10:53 pm UTC

	mysteryfan 2009-09-25 08:18 pm UTC (link)
	It's also kind of sad as I thought that this story provided a very strong indication on how they would have handled Steph's situation Oh, and I haven't read the entire run, but I'm inclined to agree with you so far. (Reply to this) (Parent)

sistermagpie
2009-09-25 07:59 pm UTC (link)

I like this a lot. And interesting that Cass says nobody talks about Jason, which is echoed elsewhere. It always makes me think about that moment in "The Boys" when Tim starts to bring him up and stops, and Dick says something like "Jason. You can say his name." And they do talk about him. Because I think Tim and Dick have their own unique relationship to the whole Jason history and Dick made clear early on that Tim should talk about him any time he needed to.

If they have doubts about someone's abilities they say so, since Jason. Not that Jason died because he was reckless, as it happens. But Bruce, especially, can't help but ask himself if he's at fault for ignoring any doubts he had. And of course being Bruce he also needs to think there's a lesson there that, if learned, will help him avoid tragedy in the future.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

mysteryfan
2009-09-25 08:14 pm UTC (link)

I like it, too. And yes. I'm so glad that Dick can let Tim talk about Jason and listen. They do have their own unique relationship to Jason and Jason's loss.

If they have doubts about someone's abilities they say so, since Jason. Not that Jason died because he was reckless, as it happens.
Those are both really good points. (I think I forgot for a moment that it wasn't actually recklessness.) And yes, being Bruce, he does have to ask himself if he's at fault.

And of course being Bruce he also needs to think there's a lesson there that, if learned, will help him avoid tragedy in the future.

I love that. So true. If he can come up with a plan, learn the lesson--nobody else has to die.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

jeyl
2009-09-25 08:00 pm UTC (link)

"He thinks about calling Barbara. He doesn't"

Why am I not surprised? Especially after he thinks she's the strongest person he knows. I guess it's because she's a girl. After all, I don't recall Bruce putting up anything for Stephanie's Robin. He was all Trumpy on her with the "You're fired" and "I don't want to see Spoiler either", so why should we give a crap what he thinks when he says "I guess it's not too late for Stephanie."?

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	sistermagpie 2009-09-25 08:03 pm UTC (link)
	He doesn't call any guys either. He calls Cass, who is a girl. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

bluefall, 2009-09-25 09:18 pm UTC

sistermagpie, 2009-09-25 09:21 pm UTC

trelas, 2009-09-25 09:46 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-25 10:23 pm UTC

01d55, 2009-09-26 05:28 am UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-26 01:53 pm UTC

trelas
2009-09-25 08:07 pm UTC (link)

First of all, nice of you not think about Cass as a woman.

Secondly, this story was published before the decision was even made for Steph to become a Robin, which derailed the whole plan they had for the buildip. If you really wish to complain about Bruce's behaviour, pick the GK issue where he told Steph to quit being Spoiler that lead to this issue, where we were shown Bruce's side on the matter.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

jeyl, 2009-09-25 09:11 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-25 09:54 pm UTC

jeyl, 2009-09-25 10:25 pm UTC

mysteryfan
2009-09-25 09:13 pm UTC (link)

He gave Barbara a huge compliment but doesn't want to call her. There's nothing sexist there. He also, very next panels, thinks about calling other people. Also doesn't call them either. Does go to find Cass.

The "Maybe it's not too late for Stephanie" doesn't refer to Steph as Spoiler or Robin, but refers to his hope that maybe she can have a good life and not die in the hero business, like Jason.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

	silicone_soul 2009-09-25 08:10 pm UTC (link)
	Stories like this are why I love Batman. And the art is beatiful, too. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	mysteryfan 2009-09-25 09:14 pm UTC (link)
	Me too. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	oddpuppets 2009-09-25 09:17 pm UTC (link)
	So very much YES. Pete Woods is one of the most consistent and solid artists out there. If the industry standard was Woods...well, even if we have to suffer through BND and OMD, Teen Titans and endless events, it would be a pretty torture indeed. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	shadowvalkyrie 2009-09-26 08:36 am UTC (link)
	Agreed. (Reply to this) (Parent)

runespoor7
2009-09-25 08:42 pm UTC (link)

I love that Cass knows whose grave this is before Bruce speaks Jason's name.

My impression about Bruce talking to Cass is that one, she was the one seeming disturbed, and second, she's the only one who understands the Mission as he does. I get the feeling that he hasn't talked to anyone about Jason in a long, long time. He wouldn't have said so much otherwise.

"But then, he doesn't welcome anybody with open arms."
I imagine Jason dying killed that buzz very dead.

The last two pages send chills down my spine.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	mysteryfan 2009-09-25 09:17 pm UTC (link)
	True, and Cass is the one who noticed that Bruce was disturbed. By his body language and the way he was fighting earlier in the story. She knew he was troubled. Now he's showing her why, and what it's related to. I imagine Jason dying killed that buzz very dead. nods Right there with you on the last two pages. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	starwolf_oakley 2009-09-25 09:21 pm UTC (link)
	More than a few characters have wondered exactly what Jason was doing and why he wanted to do it. From NIGHTWING #99: If/When Jason returns and DC doesn't have him "Punisher up" too much, the big "why" on "Why Jason wanted to be Robin" should be explored. Did he want to be Batman someday? Did he want to be better than Dick, and how did he intend to do that? (Reply to this) (Thread)

	ashez2ashes 2009-09-25 09:57 pm UTC (link)
	I like that nod to the no win situation Steph was in. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	nevermore999 2009-09-26 02:11 am UTC (link)
	Oh, thank you! I've been looking for that quote for Dick's section on the Steph wiki. It's pretty much the only time Dick's ever mentioned Steph besides that time he talked to Tim about weird girlfriends. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	mysteryfan 2009-09-26 02:17 am UTC (link)
	That's interesting. I'd love to see that in context. Is there more discussion of Jason and Steph in the story? (I'm not up on that era of Nightwing.) (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

starwolf_oakley, 2009-09-26 02:31 am UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-26 02:45 am UTC

	kusonaga 2009-09-25 11:39 pm UTC (link)
	He should've called Aquaman. (Reply to this) (Thread)

kingrockwell, 2009-09-26 02:40 am UTC

	retro_nouveau 2009-09-26 01:47 am UTC (link)
	Oh, Bruce. I'm sure Alfred tried to talk you out of your headstrong ways. It was too late for those kids before you met them. It's a slippery slope, and all you can do is keep them close and drill them on how to cope. Kicking them out and telling them to have a nice, normal life? You're only fooling yourself to think it's remotely possible. (Reply to this) (Thread)

mysteryfan, 2009-09-26 02:48 am UTC

retro_nouveau, 2009-09-26 03:06 am UTC

teekoness, 2009-09-26 04:27 am UTC

cygna_hime, 2009-09-26 06:17 am UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-26 03:57 pm UTC

yaseen101, 2009-09-26 05:09 am UTC

	ex_octopusso248 2009-09-26 05:50 am UTC (link)
	SNIFF 's nothin'. Just got a manly speck of dust in my eye causing me to tear up. (Reply to this)

	jelly_ace 2009-09-26 05:51 am UTC (link)
	sniff He does care about his sidekicks, dick that he is. A normal life is what he wishes for them since that was the one thing that he didn't have, but always aspired to have. (Reply to this)

	zechs27 2009-09-26 02:57 pm UTC (link)
	Thanks for posting this story. This was the "final" time Cass appeared in Tec for now yes? :( (Reply to this) (Thread)

pepperspray101, 2009-09-28 02:50 am UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-09-28 03:15 am UTC

	(Anonymous) 2009-09-28 11:27 pm UTC (link)
	I still think that Batman is Alfred's sidekick/apprentice, which is why he hasn't gotten into trouble like the other Robins/Batgirls. Alfred is too good to fail at making sidekicks. (Reply to this)