Tweak

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Tweak says, "Smoof, smoof and piddly Proust"

mysteryfan (mysteryfan) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-05-10 11:21:00

Entry tags:

char: batman/bruce wayne, char: catwoman/selina kyle, char: robin/nightwing/dick grayson, creator: frank miller, publisher: dc comics, series: bat/cat, title: all-star batman and robin

Frank Miller's best Bat/Cat: All-Star Batman and Robin

I think some people are bothered by Batman calling Catwoman 'baby', and the way she's all beaten up. I'm fine with ASBAR's crazy wacked-out manchild version of Batman using that word, and I like the way he sees her as a peer (in the preview image before the cut).

The beaten up part is another, more complicated deal, but she DOES get to be tough, I don't mind crazy ASBAR Batman noticing she's small when she's not moving around fighting somebody, and I'm glad she's not sporting a black eye, wearing a Wonder Woman outfit and tied up with a golden lasso until she's rescued by Batman. Like she was in Frank Miller's 1986 Dark Knight Returns.

What a difference 22 years makes or something else? I don't know. We also can't know what was going to happen next since ASBAR's on hiatus. But I thought it was kind of an interesting contrast.

I like this one better.

(Post a new comment)

	captain_clown 2009-05-10 12:05 pm UTC (link)
	Haha I was totally did a double-take at the 'baby' thing, don't like that at all. Do like the seeing her as a peer thing though, and Batman's "lets go kid" to Robin. I hate it when Miller writes Catwoman in general, because he writes her as quite weak. And a prostitute. sigh (Reply to this) (Thread)

	mysteryfan 2009-05-10 12:26 pm UTC (link)
	I hate it when Miller writes Catwoman in general, because he writes her as quite weak. And a prostitute. She's not weak here, though. Look at her:) Full of fight and according to Jim Gordon, a lurking ability on par with Batman's. And I can't remember about the other part. I'll dig out my old ASBAR issues, but I don't think it's mentioned. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	captain_clown 2009-05-10 12:59 pm UTC (link)
	Ah yeah I see your point, I guess what I don't like is how Bats is talking about her, saying how fragile she is and stuff. Selina is powerful and independent Batman! And oh god, I was hoping that wasn't Gordon. I haven't read this so why is he being such a jerk? (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 01:11 pm UTC

sessile29, 2009-05-10 03:23 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 01:14 pm UTC

captain_clown, 2009-05-10 01:17 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 01:20 pm UTC

chipsnopotatoes
2009-05-10 01:51 pm UTC (link)

i don't like the prostitute idea that miller introduced but this scene really turned me around in my opinion of him. in his own way, he's as much of a bat/cat fan that we are.

despite the fact that she got beat up, i didn't get that she was written as weak at all. i remember writing these comments when this was first posted in scans daily:
1. "...lunatics in tights, we look out for each other" - implies some sort of reciprocity (i.e. she looks out for him too) and not just catwoman being a damsel in distress.
2. "baby" - term of endearment between two people in a relationship, not said in a belittling fashion
3. "small, light, and perfect" - even though she's supposed to be 5'8". what can i say, love is blind (or in this case, perception-altering even for the world's best goddamned detective)

this is really such a sweet scene, doubly so considering i'd never associate it with frank miller. i'm curious to see where he goes with this, hence why i'm more interested in the next issue of ASBAR than any of the other ones in continuity, yes, even sirens.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

captain_clown, 2009-05-10 01:59 pm UTC

chipsnopotatoes, 2009-05-10 02:10 pm UTC

captain_clown, 2009-05-10 05:18 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 02:34 pm UTC

chipsnopotatoes, 2009-05-10 06:47 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 07:43 pm UTC

kingrockwell, 2009-05-10 10:14 pm UTC

sailorlibra, 2009-05-10 03:28 pm UTC

chipsnopotatoes, 2009-05-10 06:40 pm UTC

psychop_rex, 2009-05-11 02:46 am UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 07:51 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 07:55 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 08:19 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 08:21 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 08:22 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 08:23 pm UTC

kingrockwell, 2009-05-10 10:06 pm UTC

benicio127, 2009-05-11 08:50 am UTC

runespoor7, 2009-05-10 08:07 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 08:21 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 08:30 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 08:54 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 08:58 pm UTC

runespoor7, 2009-05-11 10:37 am UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-11 11:37 am UTC

runespoor7, 2009-05-11 12:10 pm UTC

runespoor7, 2009-05-11 06:57 pm UTC

	greenmask 2009-05-10 12:08 pm UTC (link)
	It's a bit odd him calling her small when she doesn't look small, though. Makes it seem like he's looking at her through his crazy. Surprisingly tender, though, as a scene. (Can't help but notice how runway-model robin's pose is in the water.) (Reply to this) (Thread)

	ex_stig213 2009-05-10 12:16 pm UTC (link)
	The Ice-cold water. Which is pooling around his bare, boyish thighs. The pitch for ASBAR could probably be: "What If Batman Daydreamed That He Was The Commander Of A Hellish Boot Camp?" (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

freddylloyd, 2009-05-10 01:06 pm UTC

captain_clown, 2009-05-10 01:07 pm UTC

ex_octopusso248, 2009-05-10 02:15 pm UTC

captain_clown, 2009-05-10 05:14 pm UTC

merseybeatler, 2009-05-10 03:13 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 07:33 pm UTC

	mysteryfan 2009-05-10 01:16 pm UTC (link)
	Surprisingly tender, though, as a scene. I thought so too, especially in this crazy book, and for a love scene in a sewer where one of the parties has collapsed from a beating. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

greenmask, 2009-05-10 01:43 pm UTC

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 02:11 pm UTC

	sistermagpie 2009-05-10 01:33 pm UTC (link)
	I would take the line as a comment on her strength--she seems big because she's powerful, so when she's unconscious she seems especially small? (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 02:36 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 07:35 pm UTC

benicio127
2009-05-10 03:05 pm UTC (link)

GAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

I can *hear* Miller's voice. It's the same tone from Sin City, from the Spirit, even from the blind dude from 300. STOP IT! I don't want to hear his voice! I can hear it as he's talking about Selina, which is really just Miller using the same voice he uses for so many characters. NO! I want to hear distinct Batman voice.

*rassumfrassumMillersadfsdfskk!!!*

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	captain_clown 2009-05-10 05:15 pm UTC (link)
	SAME! I don't see Batman. I see FRANK MILLER D: (Reply to this) (Parent)

	parsimonia 2009-05-10 07:31 pm UTC (link)
	Heheh, ASBAR is fun to read out loud to yourself. It's even more amusing that way. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

mysteryfan, 2009-05-10 07:41 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 07:44 pm UTC

benicio127, 2009-05-10 09:14 pm UTC

parsimonia, 2009-05-10 09:49 pm UTC

besamim
2009-05-10 06:24 pm UTC (link)

I agree with what many of the above posters have said: this is a surprisingly tender, gentle scene from a series that otherwise is grimdark and macho to the point of parody and beyond. And I too have no problem with Selina being hurt, not only for the reasons given above but also because Batman as well gets the crap kicked out of him from time to time. (I'm not just thinking of the extreme case of Knightfall, but of other times in various series and continuities when he's lost a fight: Swamp Thing uses the old "one consciousness in multiple bodies" trick to thrash him good; the Mutant Leader in DKR nearly kills him in their first fight, and there are no doubt other instances I'm unfamiliar with.)

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	runespoor7 2009-05-10 07:43 pm UTC (link)
	Batman as well gets the crap kicked out of him from time to time Given how often Alfred complains about patching him up ("only forty-nine stitches", snarks Alfred), it might be a little more often than that. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

besamim, 2009-05-10 07:59 pm UTC

	parsimonia 2009-05-10 07:30 pm UTC (link)
	Hrmmmph...That's a fair point. (Reply to this)

mooppoom
2009-05-10 07:48 pm UTC (link)

This bugged me for different reasons. The first police officer who saw her was calling an ambulance. She refused. Gave him a note to deliver. He delivered it to the Police Commissioner, who stopped what he was doing and went down to the docks to give it to Batman.

And yet this whole thing seems to be making the point that Batman saved her and everyone's against them, because they are outsiders who live by their own rules and have to stick together against the cruel unfeeling world.

So they get to treat public officials as their servants and still revile them for not being helpful or effective. I guess this is the film noir version of having your cake and eating it, too.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	mysteryfan 2009-05-10 07:50 pm UTC (link)
	Oh, but wait! Selina saved herself. The rest, I have to come back later when I have a a little more time and type things about:) (Reply to this) (Parent)

	ar_feiniel_ 2009-05-11 07:34 pm UTC (link)
	It also seems strange to me that Selina needed Bats to save her. I mean, couldn't she just change out of costume and go to a hospital herself? She had the constitution to deliver a note at Point A, get to Point B, and wait for a considerable time for Bruce to save her, but she couldn't steal some clothes and call 911? (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

mysteryfan, 2009-05-11 08:33 pm UTC

	psychop_rex 2009-05-11 02:50 am UTC (link)
	This series is the sort of thing that I would never in a million years buy for myself, but always perk up a little when I see bits and pieces of it posted. On a similar note, any chance of posting some of the bits where he meets Black Canary, specifically, the one in the Batmobile? I've only seen a little bit of that, and it looked like it'd be interesting. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	mysteryfan 2009-05-11 11:52 am UTC (link)
	I'll see what I can do! (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

psychop_rex, 2009-05-11 02:42 pm UTC

	jlroberson 2009-05-11 04:21 am UTC (link)
	The key to understanding the Goddamn Batman? Think of it as "What If Marv Put On a Batman Costume?" When you've got a condition, you need to take your medication... (Reply to this)

	zhinxy 2009-05-11 08:22 am UTC (link)
	Forgive me. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	benicio127 2009-05-11 08:54 am UTC (link)
	I died (Reply to this) (Parent)

	mysteryfan 2009-05-11 11:21 am UTC (link)
	Awww!! You can tell it's their first time. Look how nervous he is! LOVE IT (Reply to this) (Parent)

	comicoz 2009-05-11 01:52 pm UTC (link)
	Notice "Batcomputer" and "Batradar" LABELED in that scene. I loved how campy this show is. Especially when they gave in and just lived it up, like they did in "Return to the Batcave". (Reply to this) (Parent)

chipsnopotatoes
2009-05-11 05:32 pm UTC (link)

hee hee hee...

i was watching a few of those old adam west ones on youtube a few months ago and i loved them! though campy, i thought they were so innovative in their plots -- one was catwoman coming up with a device to steal the voices of chad & jeremy (pop group circa beatles). Can Frank Miller beat that??!! NO!!

there was also an episode called "catwoman in college" where she and batman share a milkshake (one shake, two straws!). just about died!

those two have such great chemistry in ANY medium.

(Reply to this) (Parent)