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nalanzu ([info]nalanzu) wrote in [info]scans_daily,
@ 2009-06-07 22:14:00

Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:char: green lantern/hal jordan, group: green lantern corps, publisher: dc comics

I may be overanalyzing this.
This showed up in the back of a Superman comic, I think; the bit where Hal Jordan decides what the world needs is another Justice League. There was something about it that really bothered me, and I am wondering if it was just me.

Does this:



remind anyone else of this?




Here it is again. Seriously, am I the only one who thinks that it's just a short step from these-




-to these?




Before DC went all retcon and decided Parallax was a fear demon, Hal-as-Parallax's primary motivation and defining characteristic was that he wanted to fix things and make them right. It seems to me that what he appears to be doing in A Cry For Justice is incredibly consistent with his actions during Zero Hour. It's just a little less, um, drastic.

Yeah. I'm wondering if this is bothering anyone else.



(Post a new comment)


[info]icon_uk
2009-06-07 08:31 am UTC (link)
It's just a little less, um, drastic.

"... so far" I think needs to be added to that sentence

Yeah. I'm wondering if this is bothering anyone else.

Bothering? It should be reducing the rest of the JLA to freaking bed-wetting terror, considering what happened LAST time.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]tahngarth
2009-06-07 11:16 am UTC (link)
Not to worry, they have a "Break in case Hal goes nuts again" emergency cabinet in the headquarters.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]statham1986
2009-06-07 08:41 am UTC (link)
I still don't see how this justifies him breaking apart the League and establishing his own. Given he's meant to be a decent friend to Dinah, surely he'd be lending her his total support and offering her help in reforming the League into something stronger and bitch-slapping Queen into doing the same.

As it is, he doesn't have any right to talk, given he's often been slotted out of the roster for John in most stories, so where's he been whilst everything else was going on?

As much as I like Robinson's writing, this is still one of the most contrived reasons for setting up an alternate squad that I've ever seen.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]savok
2009-06-07 08:55 am UTC (link)
If McDuffie taught us anything, it's don't blame the writer for whatever happens with the JLA. Chances are it isn't their fault.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]statham1986, 2009-06-07 08:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kingrockwell, 2009-06-07 08:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]filbypott, 2009-06-07 09:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2009-06-07 10:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]yaseen101, 2009-06-07 11:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]batcookies, 2009-06-07 11:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 12:28 pm UTC

[info]yaseen101
2009-06-07 11:00 am UTC (link)
Don't know how relevant this is but Mc.Duffie's original idea was for BC to disband the League and her to rebuild it again herself. Unfortunately editorial stepped in and he got kicked out. The fact is Hal Jordan is now DC's favorite thing now, he has now got his own animated movie, his live action movie and a successful comic franchise. Stands to reason they would want to give him his own team just to make the fanboy's wet themselves.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]jlbarnett, 2009-06-07 12:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]yaseen101, 2009-06-08 01:59 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jlbarnett, 2009-06-08 04:55 pm UTC

[info]jlbarnett
2009-06-07 12:02 pm UTC (link)
technically he's not breaking apart the League. John is the JLA's Lantern. They have Red Arrow not Green Arrow. Hal and Ollie's League with have SuperGIRL and BatWOMAN. I'm not sure they're actually appropriating any members.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]statham1986, 2009-06-08 01:37 am UTC
On A Tangent...
[info]ex_stig213
2009-06-07 09:29 am UTC (link)
The title "Cry For Justice" immediately makes me think of both Black Canary and Superman, neither of whom are going to be part of the team.

(Reply to this)


[info]daningram
2009-06-07 09:40 am UTC (link)
Ya know, just once I'd love to see the idea that super heroes need to track down known law breakers and bring them in before something happens treated as a 'No shit, Sherlocke' sort of thing instead of 'That's a radical idea skirting morality'.

I understand why the majority of super heroes don't, I do. They have regulr lives that don't allow the time and effort required to capture major criminals. They'd need an overwhelming amount of contacts, someone with enough experience to shift through the information to find the gold amongst the crap, people to verify, etc.

Being 'proactive' shouldn't be treated as some radical concept, but rather, as something that's hard to accomplish for the heroes.

Also, if these guys are gonna be proactive, why in the hell isn't Oracle a member? She's about the only person left with enough contacts/information to actually allow them to accomplish their mission!

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]eldabe
2009-06-07 10:43 am UTC (link)
Actually, I'd argue that being proactive begins to tap the "Minority Report" line of morality. You're assuming that the criminal is going to do it based on circumstantial evidence. The evidence has to be circumstantial, because the criminal never actually did it!

So how do you define lawbreaker? Someone who has already broken the law is just someone you're tracking down after the fact. Someone who hasn't broken the law is someone who isn't yet a lawbreaker. It's not skirting a morality line as running through it.

Also, I don't think it could be about resources, this is DC! Land where a single billionaire manages to run an entire team of superheroes out of his basement cave! Resources? I wish they were so practical. It's probably more about the fact that a story of someone putting together a bunch of clues after wading through piles of evidence is a lot less interesting to the average reader than "BAM, POW!"

I'd also like to point out that the Outsiders Arsenal/Nightwing version was supposed to be this. It was supposed to be the proactive team that caught the criminals first! Of course, that's not really what happened, but it's historical precedent for how DC might handle this. (Badly)

As to Oracle not being on the team? I have no idea. Obviously she should have been the first person to call. I'm totally with you on that.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]daningram, 2009-06-07 11:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]jlbarnett, 2009-06-07 12:06 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]arysteia.livejournal.com, 2009-06-07 05:48 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jlbarnett, 2009-06-07 05:54 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]eldabe, 2009-06-07 10:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]eldabe, 2009-06-07 10:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bluefall, 2009-06-07 01:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]eldabe, 2009-06-07 10:48 pm UTC

[info]04nbod
2009-06-07 10:53 am UTC (link)
I think its more about villains who always evade the law and stike back with a ferocity. Instead of waiting for that strike to catch them go and get them before they do it.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]kagome654
2009-06-07 09:43 am UTC (link)
I, for one, welcome the DCU's new crazy!pants overlords...

I figure that Parallax was intended to be something that simply magnified fears and concerns that were already there. Hal's desire to 'fix' things is pretty consistent with his character. As long as he can do it without killing a bunch of his friends along the way I'm pretty okay with it.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]thehefner
2009-06-07 12:44 pm UTC (link)
Agreed!

But that said, it's worth noting Hal's desire to fix things, leading to Parallax, was originally created as a sloppy, last-minute OOC addition that DC editorial made up just to have an excuse for EMERALD TWILIGHT.

What people who cry "WAH WAH GEOFF JOHNS RETCONNED EVERYTHING!!!" don't seem to recall is that EMERALD TWILIGHT's characterization of Hal was in no way consistent with the character to that point. Look at the Hal reacting to Coast City's destruction just that month earlier in SUPERMAN, where he fought Mongul. THAT'S the Hal Jordan of that point.

I got into Hal as Parallax, and I loved that character (as a Harvey Dent fan, I love fallen angel heroes still striving for good), but the more I read of classic GL, the more I realized that they just weren't the same character. Not that I don't think they COULD have written "Hal going crazy" credibly, but not the way they actually did it.

But like it or not, it's canon now. And while I'm more than happy for Johns to retcon whatever he wants from a story that was character-inconsistent and editorally-decreed in the first place, I do like making lemonade out of these lemons by this idea that Parallax magnified and manipulated what was already there.

I think there's real potential for seeing what a sane, competent, fully heroic Hal Jordan with those attributes could accomplish. I just don't forget that they never were a part of him before EMERALD TWILIGHT.

Unless someone wants to show me evidence that he was. That could be interesting.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]kagome654, 2009-06-07 01:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 04:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kagome654, 2009-06-07 04:57 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 05:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kagome654, 2009-06-07 05:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 06:06 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kagome654, 2009-06-07 06:41 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 06:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 06:57 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kagome654, 2009-06-07 08:57 pm UTC

[info]volksjager
2009-06-07 10:22 am UTC (link)
It might carry more wieght if GL didn't recruit Congorilla...

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]espanolbot
2009-06-07 10:53 am UTC (link)
It would carry more weight if it wasn't the exact same idea behind Justice League Elite and the various Outsiders teams.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]daningram, 2009-06-07 11:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]espanolbot, 2009-06-07 11:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kagome654, 2009-06-07 12:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]werehawk, 2009-06-07 01:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]buttler, 2009-06-07 11:20 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]filbypott, 2009-06-07 08:00 pm UTC

[info]mullon
2009-06-07 10:40 am UTC (link)
Isn't this why Batman goes on patrols? And why they take turns in the Monitor Room?

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]thokstar, 2009-06-07 10:51 am UTC

[info]thokstar
2009-06-07 10:41 am UTC (link)
Somebody on another board suggested that Green Arrow's comments in this preview recognize the whole "Hal's acting like he was before the whole Parallax thing" and that Ollie's primary motivation for joining up with this team is to make sure Hal doesn't go over the line again.

(This is actually something I could see Ollie doing, except that GA's interactions with Black Canary in JLA make less sense in that scenario.)

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]kingrockwell, 2009-06-07 08:49 pm UTC

[info]greenmask
2009-06-07 10:46 am UTC (link)
I can't.. THINK about that now..

Hee hee. Haltra Magnus.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]thandrak, 2009-06-07 11:51 am UTC

[info]okkult3000
2009-06-07 10:54 am UTC (link)
Ah, "proactive superheroes." How I've missed the '90s. "We're not your grandaddy's Justice League! We're PROACTIVE! To the XTREEEEEEM!" With Fantastic Force and "proactive" JL, how long until Force Works makes a comeback?

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]espanolbot, 2009-06-07 11:15 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]daningram, 2009-06-07 11:28 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bluefall, 2009-06-07 01:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kingrockwell, 2009-06-07 08:57 pm UTC

[info]tacobob
2009-06-07 11:47 am UTC (link)
Geez Hal! Go ahead and give us more work! Thanks! I'm superhero, but I'm also very lazy. It's easy to hear the call "Help! Tacobob!", then you fly over to the rubble, and usually the bad guy will be at the end doing some speech or something silly, which gives me time to punch him out, toss him into the nearest jail, and then it's back to the booze. Next Mister Happy Hal will want us to do detective work...Hmmph!

(Reply to this)


[info]zechs27
2009-06-07 11:57 am UTC (link)
The heroes better crack open the Hal is going Nutty Emergency case. He's acting like he was in the 90s again.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]kagome654, 2009-06-07 12:04 pm UTC

[info]cmdr_zoom
2009-06-07 12:30 pm UTC (link)
It should be noted that back during Zero Hour, a significant portion of the fandom thought Hal was right. Particularly because he was being used by editorial as a straw man/mouthpiece for the things they'd been saying (sound familiar?).

To quote Portal: "That's you! That's how dumb you sound."

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 12:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]xlineartx, 2009-06-07 12:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bluefall, 2009-06-07 01:48 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 04:18 pm UTC

[info]xlineartx
2009-06-07 12:33 pm UTC (link)
Can I just say my least favorite part is Ollie choosing Hal over Dinah? NO. Just no. That's undoing like ten years of character development for him and completely disrespectful to her. Ollie has learned his lesson when it comes to ditching family for Hal. It is a BAD IDEA. I hope Roy gets to tell him this.

Also, I miss Hal's dashing gray streaks. They were dashing.

I think it's safe to say that Hal will not go crazypants so long as Geoff Johns works for DC. Or Dan DiDio for that matter. They love him too much! If the past few years have taught me anything, it's that Hal Jordan has no flaws.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]kingrockwell, 2009-06-07 09:05 pm UTC

[info]werehawk
2009-06-07 12:56 pm UTC (link)
This is exactly why Hal Jordan as Parallax (pre-fear entity retcon) made sense. It shows why Marz was a (misunderstood) genius. Hal is the perfect example of the fine line between hero and villain and the slippery slope he tried to walk. He didn't destroy the central power battery (in GL) and try to remake the universe (in Zero Hour) to cause FEAR, he wanted to remake Coast City and right the wrongs done to people he cared about (and overlooking the damage he was causing).

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 04:18 pm UTC

[info]freeman333
2009-06-07 01:34 pm UTC (link)
Even when he's not Parallax, Hal is a politically terrifying guy. Remember that comment he made about "the only people who object to surveillance are the ones with something to hide"? Thank you, Green Lantern Cheney...

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 06:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]filbypott, 2009-06-07 08:03 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]thehefner, 2009-06-07 08:05 pm UTC
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[info]huannine
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