InsaneJournal

Tweak says, "'Cause I'm Kevin frickin' Solo"

Doop (xdoop) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-11-13 01:30:00

Entry tags:

char: cyclops/scott summers, char: phoenix/marvel girl/rachel summers, char: white queen/emma frost, creator: andy park, creator: chris claremont, title: uncanny x-men

Emma Frost vs. Rachel Summers!

This is from Uncanny X-Men #452, by Chris Claremont and Andy Park.

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	xdoop 2009-11-13 06:00 pm UTC (link)
	It wasn't intentional cruelty; she was a cosmic entity who needed to sustain herself. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	icon_uk 2009-11-13 07:02 pm UTC (link)
	It wasn't intentionally cruelty no, but as cosmic level dismissiveness goes, I don't think that lessens the guilt. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	arkyramone 2009-11-13 08:09 pm UTC (link)
	Actually that was the force/clone thing, X-Factor #1 Jean had no knowledge of this and was angry of what it did in her name (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	icon_uk 2009-11-13 08:23 pm UTC (link)
	IIRC (and I might not) Jean absorbed the memories of the Phoenix version of herself (possibly from the holempathic matrix thing), and knows what it did and how it felt. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	seriousfic 2009-11-14 12:42 am UTC (link)
	But it was an exact clone of her, i.e. doing exactly what she would've done under the same circumstances. Therefore, at best you could say that Jean is willing to destroy a planet, if the circumstances are right. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	xdoop 2009-11-14 12:54 am UTC (link)
	Yes, if she gets possessed by a powerful, godlike cosmic entity that needs to eat a sun for sustenance. (Reply to this) (Parent)

ex_gunny827
2009-11-14 01:05 am UTC (link)

Sorry, I have to disagree with this statement. Let me summarize real quick and then I'll get to the disagreement part.

The Phoenix cloned Jean's body and stole her memories to mimic Jean while she healed. In the process, the Phoenix forgot who she was and became who she thought Jean was. During all this, normal human feelings and instincts became blurred with the Phoenix who had never encountered such things and gave into them or resisted them. Things the real Jean never would have done because she's ...human. She knows and understands these things. For example, the Phoenix had a hard time dealing with the animal attraction with Logan, where the real Jean was never attracted to Logan at all and actually found him repulsive. This all changed later on when both characters evolved and grew close. Those feelings the Phoenix had for Logan were given to Jean and this no doubt played a part in the growing, but forbidden attraction Jean grew for Logan later on. Anyway...

So, the disagreement. I disagree because the Phoenix had experienced a great trauma at the hands of Mastermind, something the cosmic entity had never experienced before and lashed out. The Phoenix freaked out, basically. Jean was repulsed by what the Phoenix had done while wearing her skin because she never would have reacted that way and rejected the Phoenix when it came back to her while still in the cocoon. Why? Because Jean is human and accustomed to human feelings and emotions, good and bad. The Phoenix didn't have a clue. She was running on borrowed memories and no real experience in being human. To say the Phoenix and Jean are exactly the same is a real misunderstanding of how infantile the Phoenix really is when it comes down to dealing with humans and interaction with them. Jean pretty much had to teach the Phoenix the ABC's of behavior later on and even then, the Phoenix continued to act like a spoiled child (rezzing Jean from her grave in that horrible 'Phoenix Endsong' storyline).

Jean would NEVER destroy a planet out of selfish needs to sustain herself. EVER. The Phoenix would because it's her nature as a cosmic entity. What are the billions of lives to a cosmic entity?? Nothing. There will always be more life elsewhere. Jean doesn't think this way and never has. She's always seen the big picture and been the humanitarian (for the most part). She would have found a way to cripple herself or off herself to avoid doing what the Phoenix did when the Phoenix was consumed by inexperience with unknown human emotions.

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	xdoop 2009-11-14 01:18 am UTC (link)
	The Phoenix destroyed a sun; it didn't know about the planet at the time. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	ex_gunny827 2009-11-14 03:54 am UTC (link)
	Yes, you're right. It was a sun she ate which destroyed the planet I was talking about. I realized my mistake a few minutes ago, thanks for the correction. :) (Reply to this) (Parent)

	seriousfic 2009-11-14 12:21 am UTC (link)
	To borrow from Freaks & Geeks, "That don't make ~~the bricks any lighter~~ the broccoli any livelier." (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	xdoop 2009-11-14 12:46 am UTC (link)
	How is it any worse than Galactus needing to eat planets to survive? At least Phoenix saved the universe beforehand. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	(Anonymous) 2009-11-14 01:57 am UTC (link)
	Galactus has saved the universe a couple of times too. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	icon_uk 2009-11-14 09:52 am UTC (link)
	Not "worse", so much as "just as bad". (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	xdoop 2009-11-14 04:17 pm UTC (link)
	And yet Galactus is considered to be a force of nature. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	icon_uk 2009-11-14 04:37 pm UTC (link)
	Which excuses him how? Many races would happily see him dead (and Reed Richard's defence of him was one of the most absurd pieces of rubbish Byrne ever wrote) The major difference is that Galactus is not (nor has he been in the Universe's lifetime) human. The Phoenix was controlled by the human side it had sought to merge with. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	xdoop 2009-11-14 08:17 pm UTC (link)
	Fair enough. Though since Phoenix saved everything in existence once, I think she's allowed to eat one sun. :p (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	icon_uk 2009-11-14 09:35 pm UTC (link)
	Heck, I don't even begrudge her the broccoli side-salad. (Reply to this) (Parent)

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