InsaneJournal

Tweak says, "Must stay focused!"

trueredorion (trueredorion) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-06-03 10:58:00

Entry tags:

char: alfred pennyworth, char: batman/dick grayson, char: robin/damian wayne, char: robin/nightwing/dick grayson, creator: frank quitely, creator: grant morrison, title: batman and robin

Batman And Robin #1
Four pages form today's Batman and Robin #1.

Dick and Alfred:

Batman and Robin:

Previews of whats to come:

(Post a new comment)

	jackissuperfly 2009-06-03 01:11 pm UTC (link)
	I really disliked this issue, but I'm having trouble putting aside my personal feelings about Damian's dumb ass. I just really dislike the character, and it couldn't be more obvious that Morrison's just in love with the little shit. So now I seize on every offensive thing he does, and all in all the story leaves a bad taste in my mouth. (Reply to this)

ladymirth
2009-06-03 01:16 pm UTC (link)

The art is eye-bleedingly horrible even though the colors kinda compensate. But I cannot forgive how my beautiful Dick is drawn like a seedy Adam West with ASBAR-Batman-like stubble. I also think Damien looks like Chris O'Donnell's head on a stick. Alfred looks like Dr. Watson and does Bruce have bobcut hair in that picture?

God knows I want this to end well, but it's Morrison so...*crawls back under the bed and hums loudly*

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	ladymirth 2009-06-03 01:17 pm UTC (link)
	Also, the Bat ears = FAIL. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	ladymirth 2009-06-03 01:24 pm UTC (link)
	Oh, all right, so it's only the people that are horribly drawn. The background's pretty good. I just...why does my Dick have a prosthetic Clooney chin?! (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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selenesue, 2009-06-03 01:35 pm UTC

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mysteryfan, 2009-06-03 01:49 pm UTC

stig
2009-06-03 01:37 pm UTC (link)

Loving it.

I predict the newest Red Hood is not Jason but Joker. Continuing with the multiple-rotating personas theory, his being knocked off a bridge by the 'red and black' pattern has "short-circuited" him, so to speak; he is forced to return to his original identity and start again. Also, he seems to have a Harley-esque companion.

I look forward to the future stories, including the return of Dr. Hurt...can't wait to see what this new team gets up to!

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	daggerpen 2009-06-03 03:16 pm UTC (link)
	"I predict the newest Red Hood is not Jason but Joker." I certainly hope so. Geez, and I thought the Red Robin costume was bad... (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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janegray, 2009-06-04 04:57 pm UTC

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daggerpen, 2009-06-04 05:08 pm UTC

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kagome654, 2009-06-04 05:25 pm UTC

	toasty_fresh 2009-06-03 07:14 pm UTC (link)
	I predict the newest Red Hood is not Jason but Joker. So who would that girl behind him be, then? Isn't Harley off in some other comic book hanging out with Ivy? If Joker got another ladyfriend, I'd be pissed . . . (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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unknownscribler, 2009-06-04 04:16 am UTC

pepperspray101
2009-06-04 02:42 am UTC (link)

But the body type is wrong for the joker. Completely wrong. It's more in line with Jason's muscular body type unfortunately. Just compare Red Hood to Batman's stature. Rather similar. *tragic sigh*

Note that the Harley-esque companion has a small cape. Looking at the whole body...that's not a young woman ala Harley Quin, but a young teen girl...or young teen boy. *looking green in the face* It really reminds me of the original Robin costume, actually.

That said...I wouldn't hold it past DC to have Jason go so nuts, he puts on this whacky Red Hood costume...and picks up a young teen sidekick and makes them wear something similar to the original Robin costume to work as some deranged counter/rival team for Batman and Robin. -__-

Hey, maybe that was Winick's idea. Perhaps that was what he had planned for Jason after all when he had Jason kidnap Mia. In BftC, Jason did ask Tim and Dick to be his Robin...what makes us think he'll STOP after a dunk in the river?

*shudders* Oh lord, this is beginning to make too much DC sense. Someone please reassure me that I am totally wrong and imagining things. Please!

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daggerpen, 2009-06-04 05:12 pm UTC

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pepperspray101, 2009-06-04 06:32 pm UTC

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daggerpen, 2009-06-04 06:35 pm UTC

Oy. So uneasy about this.

sistermagpie
2009-06-03 01:38 pm UTC (link)

I'm trying to give this a chance, but Morrisson's already hitting a lot of warning bells in this first issue.

The main things we see about Damian in this issue is that 1) he's snotty. He doesn't respect Dick or Alfred, and thinks he could be Batman right now.

Also--he's awesome! Teh first thing we hear is that Damian (who's how old?)pretty much built the new flying batmobile, which Dick has to thank him for. Dick's "I'll never doubt you again, Damian" is presumably supposed to be a little amused, but it falls flat since GM seems to be using that as an excuse to have him really say it--Damian's simply not bratty enough to be amusing. He comes across as simply unable to deal politely with his inferiors.

Later he fixes the batmobile and gets another random compliment from Alfred about how Bruce always had trouble with whatever Damian's doing. It seems like they're working on that theory that braggarts suffer from low self-esteem, so Damian should be encouraged constantly. (Odd, since I get the impression that's what Talia has already done.)

Alfred responds to Damian's rudeness by ignoring it, Dick by "pretending" to go along with it ("Good, you're listening" in response to Damian's telling him not to use real names in the field because he told Damian not to.) Unfortunately, again, Damian's not bratty enough for this to really come off as soothing a child who's pushing the boundaries because he fears being rejected. So far it seems like GM is too impressed by him to make him that vulnerable.

It gets even worse when the characters have an expositional conversation to explain why Batman would drag around a kid who claims not to respect him. Dick voices doubts (not well-thought out doubts that really address the obvious problems, but a vague "what am I getting myself into?), and is answered by Alfred giving a ridiculous testimonial to Damian's awesomeness: "There's no denying he can be difficult, but underneath all the defensiveness and bluster, young Master Damian is the inheritor of his father's courage, his determination, his desire to do what is right."

Gee, thanks Alfred, for telling me how to read Damian. Except that what you just said was complete bullshit. Damian's never shown any desire to do what was right, he's never even been particularly courageous or determined. Those qualities don't exist "underneath" an actual personality that's self-preserving, spoiled and drives ambulances off bridges for fun. I can't help but think of Batman Begins' line about how "deep down" means next to nothing compared to what you actually do.

Now it seems like GM's basing a whole character on the idea that a kid can be rotten, spoiled, cruel and selfish but "deep down" be committed to doing right because he inherited that from his dad. (Even with a rather giant personality transplant from one book to another.) Which is why the Bat-operation will henceforth be about training Junior to one day inherit the cowl that's rightfully his as the possessor of the Wayne blueblood. Mostly by having all of the rest of the family act like exactly what he thinks they are--servants in his father's house.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this.

mysteryfan
2009-06-03 01:48 pm UTC (link)

Uh oh.

On everything, but especially this:
It gets even worse when the characters have an expositional conversation to explain why Batman would drag around a kid who claims not to respect him. Dick voices doubts (not well-thought out doubts that really address the obvious problems, but a vague "what am I getting myself into?), and is answered by Alfred giving a ridiculous testimonial to Damian's awesomeness: "There's no denying he can be difficult, but underneath all the defensiveness and bluster, young Master Damian is the inheritor of his father's courage, his determination, his desire to do what is right."
Oh, no!

Yikes. Picking it up later today, but yikes.

Oh, and yikes on your last paragraph, too. Huh.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

sistermagpie, 2009-06-03 01:55 pm UTC

	Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. jarodrussell 2009-06-03 02:05 pm UTC (link)
	Teh first thing we hear is that Damian (who's how old?)pretty much built the new flying batmobile, which Dick has to thank him for. Who needs Ted Kord when we have Damian?! :-D slams hand in door...repeatedly. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

parsimonia, 2009-06-04 02:17 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this.

kagome654
2009-06-03 02:11 pm UTC (link)

Alfred responds to Damian's rudeness by ignoring it, Dick by "pretending" to go along with it ("Good, you're listening" in response to Damian's telling him not to use real names in the field because he told Damian not to.) Unfortunately, again, Damian's not bratty enough for this to really come off as soothing a child who's pushing the boundaries because he fears being rejected. So far it seems like GM is too impressed by him to make him that vulnerable.

You really expect a lot from a first issue.

I would argue that he did in fact show us a touch of that vulnerability in the past. Do you remember in 'Batman & Son' how he responded when Bruce tore into him? Or, when Bruce threatened to leave him behind, how he insisted that he could be useful? He was, imvho, trying to prove that he was worth keeping around. I think this comes out less with Dick and Alfred because...who are they to him really? Why should he care what they think about him?

Gee, thanks Alfred, for telling me how to read Damian. Except that what you just said was complete bullshit. Damian's never shown any desire to do what was right, he's never even been particularly courageous or determined.

I'll give you 'doing what's right,' but I think it's hard to deny he's determined. He's like a nasty little terrier that won't let something go once he's set his sights on it. And he has put himself at personal risk for those he cares about before (Talia), or at least under Morrison. His overcoming his own hesitation (even fear) to fight in the last chapter of the 'Resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul' storyline (but only after Batman explicitly stated that he expected great things from him) struck me as rather brave.

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Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

freddylloyd, 2009-06-03 02:25 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

kagome654, 2009-06-03 02:34 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

sistermagpie, 2009-06-03 02:43 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

sistermagpie, 2009-06-03 02:41 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

kagome654, 2009-06-03 02:55 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

sistermagpie, 2009-06-03 03:01 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

kagome654, 2009-06-03 03:10 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

sistermagpie, 2009-06-03 03:17 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

parsimonia, 2009-06-04 02:33 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

sistermagpie, 2009-06-04 02:39 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

parsimonia, 2009-06-04 02:48 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

darkknightjrk, 2009-06-03 07:38 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this. -

mysteryfan, 2009-06-04 04:27 pm UTC

Re: Oy. So uneasy about this.
(Anonymous)
2009-06-03 03:54 pm UTC (link)

To be fair, it's Alfred. If anyone is able to see the genuine qualities in a person, and think the best of them, it's him. Especially if those qualities remind him of Bruce.

But my fears of Morrison overplaying Damian were mostly quelled in Batman #666, where he has an adult Damian flat-out state that he knew he could never be as good as Bruce or Dick. I'm guessing that what he'll be going for in this run is that although Damian might be a ridiculous polymath, it doesn't make him Batman.

-PH

(Reply to this) (Parent)

	freddylloyd 2009-06-03 02:03 pm UTC (link)
	It's the original Ace the Bat-Hound! (Reply to this)

jarodrussell
2009-06-03 02:04 pm UTC (link)

So...they stole Blue Beetle's flying Bug idea for Batman, just like Green Arrow stole the idea for the Arrow Mobile from Batman. Epic fail.

And lest anyone try to harangue me about forming opinions of a comic book based off a silhouette...much like moronic Iron man fans criticize me for critiquing Stark's engineering choops...don't bother. I don't read Batman comics, don't read Grant Morrison comics, and couldn't give two tugs of a dead dog's dick about how this book makes your no-no's tingle. I don't like it.

And lest anyone want to point at the Flying Batcave which appeared in 1952, years before Ted Kord and the Bug, I should point out that (a) it's a helicopter, and (b) the new Bat-mobile has almost the same ground profile as the Bug, with six protrusions around an ovoid body.

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(Anonymous)
2009-06-03 03:43 pm UTC (link)

It's fine if you don't care about the book, but you're still stating an opinion on it, and I think it's uninformed. It's a flying car. The actual design looks nothing like Ted Kord's Bug (the four protusions on the sides are collapsible wings, and the two on the back are fins, like what the Batmobile usually has) and I don't think Steve Ditko invented the very concept of flying vehicles. If anything it's more reminiscent of the Batmobile from Batman Beyond.

-PH

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tanetris, 2009-06-03 09:02 pm UTC

aaron_bourque
2009-06-03 04:40 pm UTC (link)

And lest anyone want to point at the Flying Batcave which appeared in 1952, years before Ted Kord and the Bug, I should point out that (a) it's a helicopter, and (b) the new Bat-mobile has almost the same ground profile as the Bug, with six protrusions around an ovoid body.

I agree that the legging on the new Batmobile is definitely odd. I would like an explanation on that. However, the Bug still has more in common with the Flying Batcave than this flying Batmobile has with the Bug. The Bug was a portable base, like the Flying Batcave. This is whiz-bang gadgetry, like BTBATB.

Just for reference: http://www.toonopedia.com/beetle3.htm (the Bug)
http://www.thefifthbranch.com/gorilladaze/?p=81 (Flying Batcave)

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peahaich, 2009-06-03 04:50 pm UTC

kagome654
2009-06-03 02:18 pm UTC (link)

Well, I liked it.

Though to be honest I'm working under the assumption that Damian's in for a rather nasty blow to his ego by the time this is all over and Morrison is actually working to prove to Damian (and the other doubters out there) why Dick Grayson is worthy of respect (and the mantle, if he truly wants it). I am also wholly prepared to eat crow if the entire thing ends up being one long love note to Damian.

Plus I'm just impressed that Damian actually thanked Alfred for something. Baby steps, baby steps...

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	darkknightjrk 2009-06-03 07:29 pm UTC (link)
	"Though to be honest I'm working under the assumption that Damian's in for a rather nasty blow to his ego by the time this is all over" Considering Damian's stomping out in the "Do Not Miss" page, I think it's a safe assumption. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	thandrak 2009-06-03 02:59 pm UTC (link)
	A Lazarus Pit... and the All Star Batgirl? Okay, something wrong here. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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bluefall, 2009-06-03 03:14 pm UTC

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darkknightjrk, 2009-06-03 07:28 pm UTC

moneyless_jew
2009-06-03 03:32 pm UTC (link)

I really liked it. Why people seem to think it is some piss-take where Damian slaps Dick and Alfred around and shows them he is the best and they suck is beyond me. That's clearly not the book. Yes, he's a brat. Yes, he's difficult. He's SUPPOSED to be seen as a brat. You're SUPPOSED to want to see him learn to work with Dick. He's not going to be another Batfamily member who sits around polishing the old photos and reminiscing in cozy 6-page Annual bonus stories. We don't need anymore.

And frankly, if people don't like Quitely now, why buy it. It's Quitely. It's weird. This isn't news.

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sistermagpie, 2009-06-03 03:42 pm UTC

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moneyless_jew, 2009-06-03 05:00 pm UTC

	batcookies 2009-06-03 04:16 pm UTC (link)
	...Wait. Did ... are you people saying Damian built a flying car? That one they're parachuting (or whatever) from, high in the night sky? A FLYING CAR? He's, like, SEVEN BLOODY YEARS OLD!!! I'm going to have an aneurysm. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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batcookies, 2009-06-03 05:26 pm UTC

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sistermagpie, 2009-06-03 07:16 pm UTC

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kagome654, 2009-06-03 08:07 pm UTC

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batcookies, 2009-06-03 11:03 pm UTC

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sistermagpie, 2009-06-04 09:17 am UTC

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pepperspray101, 2009-06-04 02:30 am UTC

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unknownscribler, 2009-06-04 04:22 am UTC

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ladymirth, 2009-06-04 08:53 am UTC

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kagome654, 2009-06-04 09:15 am UTC

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sistermagpie, 2009-06-04 09:22 am UTC

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kagome654, 2009-06-04 10:11 am UTC

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sistermagpie, 2009-06-04 10:30 am UTC

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kagome654, 2009-06-04 10:58 am UTC

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sistermagpie, 2009-06-04 11:16 am UTC

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pepperspray101, 2009-06-05 12:18 am UTC

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janegray, 2009-06-04 05:11 pm UTC

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pepperspray101, 2009-06-05 12:04 am UTC

	zegim 2009-06-03 06:09 pm UTC (link)
	I didn't care too much about this issue. Now, Grant Morrison related wank. That's what I'll enjoy :D (Reply to this)

	xlineartx 2009-06-03 08:48 pm UTC (link)
	You know, when they first started hinting that there'd be a new Robin, I assumed it had to be Steph--why else would they bring her back at such a key juncture? But no. >:( Morrison. Look, I'm willing to maybe accept that Talia had a kid with Bruce and okay, sure, he can run around Gotham City for a bit, but he hasn't earned the right to be Robin. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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majingojira, 2009-06-04 12:12 am UTC

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shadowvalkyrie, 2009-06-04 04:18 am UTC

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kagome654, 2009-06-04 07:33 am UTC

nymphgalatea
2009-06-04 12:45 pm UTC (link)

I love Damian, and I love him precisely because he's an arrogant little shitheel. I suppose it would get old after a while, but I believe Alfred will give him a good smack by issue 5, and he will be all the better for it.

I really liked this issue. It's just so *nice* to have Dick being reasonably upbeat. It would have been so easy -and so dully predictable- to have him go the broody & grim route as a result of Bruces' death, so Morrison's writing of him as calm, cheerful and confident in himself is just wonderful.

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