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Tweak says, "Do not save the pilgrim!"

arbre_rieur (arbre_rieur) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-04-15 23:10:00

Entry tags:

title: fables

Beast vs. the Big Bad Wolf (Fables #83)
One's the former sheriff of Fabletown. The other's his replacement in the new (well, not so new by this point) liberal administration. In this issue, they come to physical blows.

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	blake_reitz 2009-04-16 02:09 am UTC (link)
	First page, third panel. I get the feeling Snow White said "The ONLY WAY to STOP this is to ADOPT a Jack KIRBY STANCE and EYEBROWS!" And Beauty said, "ok, sounds good." (Reply to this) (Thread)

	filkertom 2009-04-16 06:48 am UTC (link)
	I was thinking that the Beast looked like Jack Kirby had done design work for Disney. :) (Reply to this) (Parent)

	foxhack 2009-04-16 02:11 am UTC (link)
	whipcrack Pssssssssssssst. (Reply to this)

	suzene 2009-04-16 02:13 am UTC (link)
	The art on this book is still fab and it's nice to see Snow remembering that she ~~used to rock this book so damn hard~~ has the steel that enabled her to run the whole of Fabletown. Too late to get me picking the title up again, though. (Reply to this)

	icon_uk 2009-04-16 02:31 am UTC (link)
	For the love of all the gods Bibgy just loan him the damn lawnmower! It's what neighbours do. (Reply to this)

	Bigby's "Yes Dear" moment. proteus_lives 2009-04-16 04:34 am UTC (link)
	SW/Beauty: You two can't play together anymore! Bigby/Beast: Awwwwwwwwwww. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	Re: Bigby's "Yes Dear" moment. besamim 2009-04-16 08:41 am UTC (link)
	"Now you sit in the corner and think about what you did, and don't get up until you're ready to apologize." (Reply to this) (Parent)

	Re: Bigby's "Yes Dear" moment. ghosty732 2009-04-16 09:05 am UTC (link)
	Beast/Bigby: "But... HE started it!!" (Reply to this) (Parent)

	(Anonymous) 2009-04-16 04:43 am UTC (link)
	But what happend to the hat? (Reply to this) (Thread)

	ghosty732 2009-04-16 12:36 pm UTC (link)
	The whole fight was a ploy by Beauty to get Snow White to forget about her hat so she could take it? (Reply to this) (Parent)

	carolcarolcarol 2009-04-16 07:03 am UTC (link)
	So, Fables has turned into "According to Jim"? Bad, cliched episodes of "According to Jim"? Good to know. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	dustbunny105 2009-04-16 02:32 pm UTC (link)
	Bad, cliched episodes of "According to Jim"? Are there other episodes of According to Jim? (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	carolcarolcarol 2009-04-16 07:19 pm UTC (link)
	Good point. (And, again, why Fables isn't so appealing.) (Reply to this) (Parent)

	wheresmything 2009-04-16 07:21 am UTC (link)
	Why are Beast and Beauty up at the farm? And I thought Bigby wasn't allowed there? Context? (Reply to this) (Thread)

ghosty732
2009-04-16 09:02 am UTC (link)

Well, there are some spoilers for recent events in Fables here:

A new enemy named Mr. Dark (who represents all the dark and evil characters, like the Boogey Man) literally destroyed Fabletown. The Farm was far enough away not to be destroyed, so the Fables are once again displaced and setting up camp with all the non-human Fables. Under the circumstances, Beast was not enforcing the law preventing Bigby from being at the Farm, but in the previous issue that confrontation finally arose. Turns out they were being affected by Mr. Dark, who is bringing out the nasty in everybody (mostly the Mundy population of New York).

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	foxhack 2009-04-16 09:52 am UTC (link)
	So... Mr. Dark is Vigo the Carpathian from Ghostbusters II? (Reply to this) (Parent)

	ghosty732 2009-04-16 09:11 am UTC (link)
	It's nice to know that even terrible monsters still get pwned by their wives. (Reply to this)

	dorksidefiker 2009-04-16 12:23 pm UTC (link)
	It's nice to see that Snow has firmly established her place as Alpha of the pack. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	suzene 2009-04-16 07:41 pm UTC (link)
	Mmmm. Werewolf: The Apocalypse. Now I feel like I need to go dig my Strider out of mothballs. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	ashtoreth 2009-04-17 01:45 am UTC (link)
	Everytime I hear about some knockoff like Twilight, I want to read White Wolf universe stories.. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	dorksidefiker 2009-04-17 12:47 pm UTC (link)
	I miss Original World of Darkness so badly, there are no words. ESPECIALLY when I run into someone reading @%#^@! Twilight. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	dorksidefiker 2009-04-17 12:48 pm UTC (link)
	My old WtA (and more than a few of my Hunter: the Reckoning) characters have a nasty habit of dropping in on my headspace and demanding attention. I miss those games. Hell, I miss those BOOKS (had to sell my whole collection to my brother for rent money). (Reply to this) (Parent)

	arilou_skiff 2009-04-16 02:45 pm UTC (link)
	God, there is something about Fable that just rubs me the wrong way. I liked it in the beginning, but it's like the characters just turned into zombies somehow. Also, I hate Bigby with a passion. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	filbypott 2009-04-16 04:02 pm UTC (link)
	I lost interest when the author started using it to advocate secret prisons and torture. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

ghosty732
2009-04-16 04:09 pm UTC (link)

Seriously?

I know I'm a fan of the series, so my opinion is obviously biased towards a "I like the series" position, but I just never understood the "I hate that it's become Bill Willingham's political medium" opinion that's circulated the internet.

I'll admit that the Israel analogy was heavy-handed (really, it could have been better left implied rather than Bigby spelling it out), but I find that people see political issues in this book where you really must be looking for them. The story is a pretty good one if you aren't constantly looking for this stuff.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

filbypott
2009-04-16 08:52 pm UTC (link)

Well, first of all, I think that Bigby and Prince Charming keeping the Wooden Soldiers' heads in a secret location because the people "don't need to know" or some such and torturing Baba Yaga for information were pretty tacitly in support of things like Guantanamo Bay.

I didn't hate the title. I thought it had an okay storyline, and the art was gorgeous. But I just couldn't enjoy the series knowing that Willingham was writing it in part to validate his political beliefs, so rather than go on bitching about it, which would do neither myself nor the author any favors, I stopped reading it.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

daningram
2009-04-16 09:08 pm UTC (link)

Uhh, what?

Interogating and keeping prisoners in solitary is pretty much SOP for law enforcement. And with Fabletown, given their decidingly limited resources, was pretty much required.

I really think people are taking Bigby's Israel comment in 50 and trying to apply it retroactively to the entire series and that really don't work. Really, what he meant was 'Hit us and we'll hit you back harder and smarter'. 'Cause I really don't see Israel granting Hitler clemency anytime soon.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

besamim
2009-04-16 09:39 pm UTC (link)

Well said. There's occasional overtly political content in Fables, but the only two scenes that really stood out that way to me were the aforementioned Israel analogy and an earlier issue (don't recall which) where Snow comes out against abortion, though privately, to her physician. Otherwise yeah, I don't see the series as a conservative manifesto in the way that much of Ditko's work is an objectivist manifesto or V for Vendetta an anarchist manifesto. The latter, as with much of Moore's other work, is far more blatantly political than Fables, the three Sandman Presents Willingham did, and that series with the chimp detective put together. Same with Grant Morrison, Jaime Delano and a number of other leading comic writers I could name.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	ashtoreth 2009-04-17 01:52 am UTC (link)
	The other abortion thing was that apparently the Black Forest Witch has been financing abortion clinics, and that counts for her power need to sacrifice babies. However, this excerpt up top is pretty lackluster IMHO, and so was the bits of Mr. Dark that were posted. So unless these are just the bad parts, I'm guessing that the series is past it's best days. (Reply to this) (Parent)

ghosty732
2009-04-16 09:56 pm UTC (link)

Exactly. Other than the Israel rant, I find every other scenario that people suggest is "Bill Willingham's conservative agenda" to have organic reasons behind them that make sense to the plot and the character and are, in my mind, compelling.

It's just unfortunate that people really do seem to take that one comment and try to apply it retoractively to the entire series. And it's unfortunate that people do that and look at that DC Decisions issue and dub him as "That Crazy Conservative Writer who always puts his values into all his work" when, if you look at the majority of his work, that just isn't the case.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

	ghosty732 2009-04-16 10:00 pm UTC (link)
	And obviously this isn't against you not liking the book, as that is totally your choice. I just see people criticize Fables for these reasons and I don't understand it. There are other things to criticize about the series (like Bill Willingham's dialogue occasionally sounding really forced) that have a much more valid basis. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	ay yup pervymax 2009-04-16 05:25 pm UTC (link)
	Agree 100%. There was a lot of that going around @ the time: It Was The Think To Do. It's the same reason I started hating Lost. (Reply to this) (Parent)

besamim
2009-04-16 04:07 pm UTC (link)

I think it reached a peak with The Good Prince but kind of lost its spirit afterwards. I haven't been following it monthly since the fall of the Empire in #75 and its epilogue in #76, partly because I think amnesty compact or no amnesty compact, the fables should've tried Gepetto for war atrocities and locked him up in a wood-free cell for life. None of this "you're one of us now, so welcome and behave yourself" rot. (Can't believe that I, as a mostly progressive person, am actually advocating a harsher fate for a war criminal than the conservative Willingham, but there you go.) No wonder they got knocked over by a surprise attack just issues later. :-p

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	ghosty732 2009-04-16 04:12 pm UTC (link)
	Well, spoilers: In one of the previous issues, Gepetto was ambushed by some Farm Fables who decided to bury him in a very, very deep hole. Seriously. His enchantments keep him alive and keep him from being harmed, but they don't give him super digging powers. He's still in this whole, by the way. (Reply to this) (Parent)