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Tweak says, "Brian Kinney + Justin Taylor"

starwolf_oakley (starwolf_oakley) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-09-23 23:27:00

Entry tags:

publisher: wildstorm, title: the authority

runespoor7's post of Jason Todd talking to Mia Dearden led to a thread discussion about billionaire vigilantes beating up poor criminals.

A panel from THE AUTHORITY: TRANSFER OF POWER shows that at least a few comic creators are aware of this.

"The Authority" was always pretty "out there" for superheroes. But that's Warren Ellis and Mark Millar for you.

For more than a few superheroes, actually being a superhero can be seen as a case of Noblesse Oblige. Noblesse Oblige can be seen as "With great power comes great responsibility... and a really smug sense of superiority."

It came back to Batman, as these things do. After all, we never really go into detail about how "well-off" the Kents were from farming, or how much Clark Kent's Daily Planet take-home pay is. Some seem to think it ties into "Lonely Place of Dying," that since Tim Drake's family is wealthy, Tim isn't as "street" as Jason Todd.

Quotes from users via http://asylums.insanejournal.com/scans_daily/987439.html?thread=27947311#t27947311:

runespoor7 said: "The fact is, 'Oh, Jason was lower class and her turned out badly, and then he was replaced by Tim, who came from a good family the same side of the streets as Bruce and who did very well as Robin' leaves a strange impression."

lynxara said: "In particular, confronting the class issues at work in the Batman stuff is impossible without coming to the conclusion that most of the characters involved are selfish monsters so steeped in white privilege that they've lost all grasp of reality."

icon_uk said: "Dick was suddenly an ethnic Romany with angst about the likelihood of him ending up in jail like so many of his kin."

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aaron_bourque
2009-09-24 08:34 pm UTC (link)

a fair start.

Uh, no it's not.

"which of these characters have 1)died; 2)been portrayed as incompetent; 3)been depicted as 'not right'; 4)deserving what happened to them"

How many times has Batman been portrayed as "not right"?

How many times has the Huntress been portrayed as "incompetent" or "not right"?

How many of the characters who died are still dead now?

I'm not touching "deserving" because . . . well, it's the most subjective, honestly.

Now, flip the questions around. Were these characters killed off, portrayed as incompetent, portrayed as "not right" etc, because of their economic background or "class status"?

NO!!!!

It was never because of economic background. Finding it to be so is like what Wertham did with Batman and Robin in the 40s or 50s (to answer your question about sexual interpretation and subtext--the subtext is unintentional at worst).

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runespoor7
2009-09-24 08:50 pm UTC (link)

By 'not rght' I meant as a crime-fighter. It was very unclear in my original phrasing, I apologize for that.

Helena is more linked to the 'genetics' side - all of them are. Moreover, class isn't all about money, and in that sense Helena is definitely not from the same world as Tim.

The deaths were meant to be permanent. One lasted a significant time, and the other was retconned due to fan outcry.

I'm not touching "deserving" because . . . well, it's the most subjective, honestly.

There have been scenes where 'Steph/Jason deserved what they got' is clearly between the lines. I have an old issue where an editor answers a fan letter practically with these words regarding Jason's death.

Now, flip the questions around. Were these characters killed off, portrayed as incompetent, portrayed as "not right" etc, because of their economic background or "class status"?

NO!!!!

I have no idea where you're taking this 'because' from. This is where you don't understand what I'm talking about: the 'because' doesn't matter. There's no explicit 'because' from point A to point B, and it doesn't invalidate what I'm saying. Class issues in the portrayal of the Batfamily, like gender issues, exist whether anyone means them to exist or not.

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	aaron_bourque 2009-09-25 01:06 am UTC (link)
	Class issues in the portrayal of the Batfamily, like gender issues, exist whether anyone means them to exist or not. We're done talking. (Reply to this) (Parent)

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