InsaneJournal

Tweak says, "HAIL ASGARDIA"

jlbarnett (jlbarnett) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-09-16 21:17:00

Entry tags:

char: lois lane, char: perry white, publisher: dc comics, title: action comics

This really annoys me

One page from Action 881

Actually it pisses me off.

After years of that stuff in reality we're now getting it in comics. It's not brave doing it after the administration and others who encouraged that line of thinking are out of power. I don't want to come across as bashing Bush. I certainly thought there actually were things that shouldn't have been said(no American leader should ever be compared to Hitler okay?). But that's a case of censoring yourself for civility's sake. Not others trying to intimidate you into silence. You had your chance to be edgy DC, you missed it. This is completely unnecessary

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	neuhallidae 2009-09-17 01:54 am UTC (link)
	Wait, I'm confused. Shouldn't Lois be busy hating Supergirl anyway over Lucy? (Reply to this) (Thread)

	xdoop 2009-09-17 01:56 am UTC (link)
	I think she's defending Nightwing and Flamebird. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	queenanthai 2009-09-17 02:20 am UTC (link)
	Lois is a big enough person and journalist to put the truth above her feelings. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	omgwtflolbbqbye 2009-09-17 01:56 am UTC (link)
	Doesn't Cat mean the 'aliens everyone on this planet has championed all these years because they've literally fought, bled, and died for our very existence more times that we can count'? I'm getting Civil War deja vu... (Reply to this) (Thread)

	aaron_bourque 2009-09-17 02:04 am UTC (link)
	Doesn't Cat mean the 'aliens everyone on this planet has championed all these years because they've literally fought, bled, and died for our very existence more times that we can count'? Yes, but what have they done for her lately? (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	thokstar 2009-09-17 02:21 am UTC (link)
	Ignored her boobs. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	pyrotwilight 2009-09-17 02:22 am UTC (link)
	Well, everyone but Supergirl did anyway. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	superfan1 2009-09-17 02:47 am UTC (link)
	Lol remember that so well. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	ladywillpower 2009-09-17 02:52 am UTC (link)
	They sure as hell haven't been on MySpace. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	jeyl 2009-09-17 01:57 am UTC (link)
	Hmm. People hating others simply because they saw it on TV and anyone associated with them should be considered an enemy. I thought this stuff only happens in politics. (Reply to this)

zordboy
2009-09-17 02:02 am UTC (link)

Popular forms of entertainment can be as critical as they like of current (or even ancient) political decisions, that's been going on since the dawn of time. Playing it safe by coming in *this* late weakens the message a bit, though. But whatever.

What's more annoying -- hell, what's more infuriating -- is we have *decades* of Super-people saving the Universe once every five minutes. But oh noes! One moment of something bad happening...

...in a world of shape-shifters, doubles, clones, evil alternates from parallel futures, and people who could *easily* fake video footage to the point where it *wouldn't* be detectable. Hell, Oracle could probably do crap like that with her eyes shut. And knowledge of Oracle notwithstanding, the whole planet knows these things...

...and our heroes are evil.

Note to DC -- this plot is lame. The ungrateful assholes live over on the MU Earth, remember? Your general population of flatscans tend to have more than one braincell shared between them. Grr.

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	ashez2ashes 2009-09-17 02:12 am UTC (link)
	...... I'm not so sure about that. They elected Lex Luthor as president afer all. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	zordboy 2009-09-17 02:15 am UTC (link)
	Yeah, but still. You can't tell me Luthor didn't rig the hell out of that one. Even if the potential for that storyline unravelling in brilliant form was derailed by a crappy, crappy writer (LOOOOOOOOOOEB!). Anyway. And hell, Luthor himself explained away his actions because he ended up with an alternate-Universe twin of himself. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	daningram 2009-09-17 02:50 am UTC (link)
	"How does it feel to be stupid?" Ten bucks says that was Johns taking a shot at Loeb ;) (Reply to this) (Parent)

	aaron_bourque 2009-09-17 02:06 am UTC (link)
	They did plenty of Bush-bashing while he was in office. It was as misplaced as this, though. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	zordboy 2009-09-17 02:13 am UTC (link)
	This is true. I mean, they had 'Lex Luthor as president' running for a long time, didn't they? Until Loeb fucked it up. Someone else today posted a scan from Ellis's JLA Classified story "New Maps of Hell", and when the JLA confronts President Luthor over something shady he did in the middle East, you can see exactly what they're trying to say. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

daningram
2009-09-17 02:27 am UTC (link)

Heh, reminds me of Ellis' Jack Cross.

The set-up is that he's a liberal intelligence agent (as if all cops and military are republican). He gave a nice speech about abiding by civil rights and how 9/11 was akin to shoving a stick in a giant computer. Devastating yes, but hardly an institutional flaw. It was a nice comment...

...which didn't make the least bit of sense story wise considering that Cross *shot a man's finger off* in an earlier issue to get the information he needed.

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	jlbarnett 2009-09-17 02:31 am UTC (link)
	I don't know the story but you could probably justify that with it's situational rather than the way his agency is being told to work. It's sounds like something they could do where he's not sure if he's going to be punished or rewarded. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	daningram 2009-09-17 02:37 am UTC (link)
	If they wanna decry abuses, then they shouldn't hinge a plot point on said abuse. Something like that should have gotten the agent removed. (Reply to this) (Parent)

On Luthor and Bush:

box_in_the_box
2009-09-17 02:35 am UTC (link)

The problem is, aside from a handful of stories (Kelly did a JLA issue with President Luthor that was so obviously an anti-Iraq War screed that, EVEN AS SOMEONE WHO WAS AGAINST THE IRAQ WAR, I hated it), Luthor-as-Bush didn't really map out quite the way they wanted, did it?

After all, part of the reason why Bush-haters (myself included) hated him so much was because Bush was dumber than a bag of hammers, whereas Lex, while assuredly evil, is one of the SMARTEST MOTHERFUCKERS ON EARTH.

I mean, seriously, casting Luthor as Bush is like casting Lex Steele to play The Man With The World's Smallest Penis - it simply doesn't fit, and what was fascinating about the DCU at the time was seeing how BADLY the writers' ORIGINAL intent was FAILING, because in an ironic twist, whenever their stories FAILED to hammer home the Luthor-as-Bush theme, the stories were actually BETTER as a result.

Lex's character, in particular, went through this fascinating evolution of suddenly realizing, "Holy shit, I took over the world, and I did it legally," and then, unlike what Bush-haters like me believe Bush did to America, Luthor actually kind of made America a BETTER place - partly because he had enough ENLIGHTENED SELF-INTEREST to want to make people's lives better, but partly because he ALMOST seemed to be GROWING A CONSCIENCE.

It was fascinating because Lex was finally using his big brain to GROW UP, and it's an example of how BETTER writing can actually be WORSE for a franchise, because once the arch-villain stops being a bad guy, what the fuck do you do?

In DC's case, you hand him off to Jeph Loeb, who gives him a case of Out Of Character Stupid so that he can be kicked out of office.

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Re: On Luthor and Bush:

mcspakypants
2009-09-17 02:56 am UTC (link)

Honestly I don't think Bush was an idiot, he just wasn't a great (or even good) public speaker, plus his mispronunciation of words led to easy mocking.

And I know your opinions of the story Box, but I say Millar had the most realistic take on Luthor becoming President in Red Son. If he really put his immense mind to it, he can solve all the worlds problems in that position of power. Of course they couldn't really do that in the mainstream DC universe but I guess that means they shouldn't have done that story in the first place.

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Re: On Luthor and Bush:

zordboy
2009-09-17 04:52 am UTC (link)

I don't think Kelly apologised for that issue, because I know there was some press afterwards where he was like, "Meh." I responded by not buying the issue. I always thought Kelly was the weakest link in the Morrison/Waid/Kelly triumvirate of JLA-awesomeness anyway.

None of the Superman-writers did the effort beforehand, though. I think Loeb (or Kelly who was on "Action" at the time IIRC) admitted that they created "Luthor as president" without an exit strategy (if you'll pardon the reference).

Which is what went horribly wrong.

They should've known what the hell they were doing.

Or at least, sat down at some point over lunch, and figured out where they were going.

I think Luthor as an Evil President had great potential as an idea. I could've totally seen that as building up to a Big Summer Crossover (and after "Last Laugh", they really could've used a good one). The Downfall of President Luthor, or something. You have baggage including OWAW, NML, framing Bruce Wayne for the murder of Vesper Fairchild -- there's no way Luthor didn't do some pretty illegal things during his time in office.

In this entirely-theoretical finale, all this stuff could've been used to stop the guy and bring him down. Superman and Batman working together to bring down President Lex. I would've bought it.

But that's right! They gave him to Loeb! And Luthor's grand plan involved shooting up with kryptonite (you know, the stuff that gave him cancer a few years back), macking Amanda Waller, and mildly injuring Batman. The grand climactic finale of "President Lex" ended us as six-issues of rubbish before being forgotten about.

(incidently, I still argue that's the reason the major companies keep pairing McGuiness with Loeb. So we're distracted by the pretty art and don't pay attention to the story. It didn't work)

Fuck you DC. And no, don't have a cupcake.

(Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	Re: On Luthor and Bush: ashtoreth 2009-09-17 05:18 am UTC (link)
	Now, don't be criticizing Luthor macking on Waller! That was the best part! (Reply to this) (Parent)

	daningram 2009-09-17 02:14 am UTC (link)
	I could not possibly agree more. It's only long since the public denounced Bush that both comicbook companies (long time liberals both), actually grew the balls to attack his policies. Only with a democrat in office do they even think about doing such a thing. Dickless cowards one and all. Only after everything is finished do they take a stance. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	thokstar 2009-09-17 02:23 am UTC (link)
	Marvel has attacked Bush's policies? I'd argue that Dark Reign is a glorification of Bush-era policies. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	jlbarnett 2009-09-17 02:28 am UTC (link)
	I'm pretty sure we're supposed to want Norman out. After all they had plenty of heroes they could do this with if they didn't. (Reply to this) (Parent)

daningram
2009-09-17 02:32 am UTC (link)

Dark Reign is anything but a glorification. They use vague Bush era terms to justify countless abuses of innocent people, while Norman is shown as insane and power hungry. I don't think Norman or Hammer have had a pleasant depiction anywhere. If there is a puppy to be found, it will be punted, and then maybe raped.

Norman's claims of security are transparent, and we're told that the media eats up everything he says like it was ice-cream. You name a questionably named Bush policy, Norman's waved it around like a permission slip. His actions are a thousand times worse than most Bush parodies.

But what offends me is that Marvel only has the balls to do a storyline like this when Bush is a lame duck. They jumped on the second bandwagon to make sure that it was safe, and have kept on going.

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	blaketiger 2009-09-17 03:03 am UTC (link)
	While I've no great love for Dark Reign, in fairness, parts of Civil War were slanted the same way in 2006-2007. Hell, I seem to recall the President-For-Life in 1602 being drawn a bit like Bush, although that might just have been my reading. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

	daningram 2009-09-17 12:52 pm UTC (link)
	Civil War was slanted against Bush, but then curve-balled into support at the last minute because while Millar hates Bush's policies, he doesn't seem able to offer an intelligent alternative. They took pot-shots sure, but nothing of substance until long after Bush was out the door. That's what I take issue with. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	box_in_the_box 2009-09-17 02:22 am UTC (link)
	Just to inject a different note, since I agree with everything you're saying and thus would be unable to start a flamewar with you on this, WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED TO CAT GRANT'S CHIN? She looks like one of Hank Hill's relatives now. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	khamelea 2009-09-17 02:28 am UTC (link)
	That's a wholesome American chin, I tell you whut. (Reply to this) (Parent)

jaybee3
2009-09-17 02:30 am UTC (link)

Right. Cat Grant was always an attractive woman (with no need for implants) which is why she was a natural as Luthor's press secretary. As I've said before I hate what they've done to her (and Sam Lane, and Allura, etc). Cat Grant helped bring Morgan Edge down, she slept with him and pretended to be his girlfriend so Clark could get the goods on him. He vowed vengeance. After that she literally had to put up with years of sexual harassment from Edge's skeevy father while working for GBS (no wonder she took the Press Secretary job). There is no way the old Cat simply goes on Edge's show and agrees with his anti-alien junk. They should have just used a new character rather than turn Cat into Supergirl's J. Jonah Jameson.

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	jlbarnett 2009-09-17 02:34 am UTC (link)
	Allura's calmed down a bit recently. They even made it do her "punishments" of Kara were actually a sort of day in the life thing. SHe'd been away from Krypton so long it was a chance to refamiliarize herself with the Guilds' works (Reply to this) (Parent)

jaybee3
2009-09-17 02:43 am UTC (link)

Unless it's written really well I hate putting contemporary politics into comics (and it's rarely written well). And yes, while I'm glad the Bush admin. is gone (though I never hated the man himself and thought the comparisons to Hitler et al. from so-called progressives demeaned their own cause) the idea that attacking his policies while he is safely out of office is daring or brave or anything else is ridiculous.

It's like when we have the occasional rant against organized religion in comics - whether it's as ridiculous as Chuck Austen not knowing Catholics don't believe in the Rapture in the Make-Nightcrawler-Pope storyline or OOC as the Superman 2-parter a few years back saying he stopped attending church altogether with his parents in his early teens just because he could hear the hypocrisies of his fellow church members (despite the fact that plenty of other comics before and since have shown him attending the Smallville church with Ma and Pa with no problem, as well as being married in a church). Most comic readers aren't particularly (or at all) religious, so there's nothing brilliant about writers with a chip on their shoulder on the subject playing to their audience.

The same thing is happening with Marvel/DC post-Bush. Now they have a president they like they attack the president they didn't - but only when he's gone and discredited, not when he had 70% approval rating post-9/11. To do it then would have been daring and edgy. Stuff like this? Nah.

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	freddie_mac 2009-09-17 10:07 pm UTC (link)
	I hate putting contemporary politics into comics ... It's like when we have the occasional rant against organized religion in comics Motto. I read comics to get away from the real world. When I'm feeling masochistic, I read realclearpolitics.com and yell at the screen. Just, no -- leave the politics to the real world. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	mullon 2009-09-17 02:59 am UTC (link)
	Oh yeah? Well, Lois' unusually giant boobs are real. Top that! (Reply to this) (Thread)

	zordboy 2009-09-17 04:43 am UTC (link)
	I noticed that too, actually. It's an after-thought, but Lois must be wearing her push-up bra today. 'Cause damn woman. Damn. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	cleome45 2009-09-17 03:38 am UTC (link)
	Oh, are they out of power? [sporfle] 'Scuse me. I'll be over there in the corner, laughing my head off. :D (Reply to this)

	jcbaggee 2009-09-17 04:43 am UTC (link)
	Has Cat's head always been a water balloon? No wonder she's always trying to get us to stare at her boobs instead... (Reply to this)

	vitruvian23 2009-09-17 03:52 pm UTC (link)
	What Lois didn't say... the video may not have been faked, but how many people are out there who can impersonate people perfectly and frame them for stuff? And how many times has that happened to, oh, just about every superhero out there? (Reply to this) (Thread)

	kenn_el 2009-09-17 04:42 pm UTC (link)
	This. I love how Lois, supposed 'serious journalist' just accepts the fact that video authenticity is 'confirmed', when she clearly knows many shapeshifters and other possibilities as to why she shouldn't believe what she sees. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	daningram 2009-09-18 03:16 pm UTC (link)
	Probably because the video depicts Mon-El getting knocked out. That would mean both shape-shifting and massive super strength. Most people will accept the easiest solution, and since the video isn't faked, well... And no, don't cite White Martians. Most people wouldn't automatically jump to that conclusion after seeing a throw down like that. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

vitruvian23
2009-09-18 03:20 pm UTC (link)

Not White Martians, but other Daxamites, maybe. After all, they were still part of Invasion, right? Or was that retconned after Infinite Crisis? If not, people in the DCU will remember that there's a whole other alien race with all the same powers, allied to the Durlans who had shapeshifting...

And of course, they also all remember that time everybody on Earth had superpowers to fight Mageddon. They just never mention it.

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daningram
2009-09-18 03:25 pm UTC (link)

Why would they suspect Daximites, given that they haven't been on the planet for years? And why would people think that three imposters somehow kept their powers from the Mageddon event when no one else did?

Looks like a duck, walks like a duck...

Personally, I would think that more people would question why/how they had video at all. Didn't Mon-El's battle with the imposters take place in a sewer?

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kenn_el
2009-09-17 04:48 pm UTC (link)

People being afraid of and lashing out at the 'other', especially if the 'other' has attacked them in some way, has gone on since the beginning of time. Often in groups it takes on a self-protective mode that gets out of hand, and has been a literal device for as long as there has been story-telling. You can read whatever 'administration' or political party you wish to, because all power bases fit if one wishes them to. It says more about how you see the past and present administrations. As for Hitler, I'm not so sure no one should be compared to him. If, as the survivors of the Holocaust have always maintained, we must learn from the mistakes of history, how does ignoring parallels achieve that end?

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	milleniumrex 2009-09-17 06:30 pm UTC (link)
	Yeah, DC, Marvel's been pushing the "irrational public hates Mutants and heroes" thing so long it's become a cliche. Don't try to copy it - it's probably my least favorite part of the MU anyway. (Reply to this)

jlbarnett
2009-09-17 10:08 pm UTC (link)

I just thought of something

I thought maybe Brainiac was pulling Lane's strings. But what if it's actually Luthor. Pete Ross signed the bill that set up Project Patriot or whatever it's called. THat means it was probably created under Luthor.

Lane's probably a clone created after he saw how messed up Lois was by his death. And maybe Cat was brainwashed while she was working for him, to at least be more suspicious of Kryptonians.

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