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December Challenge: Snape and Harry

The World of Severus Snape

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December Challenge: Snape and Harry

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A young half-blood wizard with a miserable home life in a Muggle neighborhood is excited to be going to Hogwarts, a place where he feels like he'll be able to fit in for the first time in his life. He encounters an arrogant bully along the way, and is determined to be Sorted into a different House than the bully.

From the above description, you might assume that the boy is Harry Potter, but you would be wrong--it's Severus Snape. Of course, in Snape's case, I believe that he had already decided to go into Slytherin, but meeting James on the train only reinforced that desire and further prejudiced him against Gryffindor. Even Lily's being Sorted into Gryffindor wasn't enough to tempt Snape into asking the Hat to put him there. In any case, the same general description fits both Harry and Snape remarkably well. In my essay on Snape and the Marauders, I wrote:

Looking at James and Sirius and Snape's backgrounds, one might almost expect Snape to be the hero and the other two to be the villains. Snape, the young half-blood living in poverty, magically talented but with an unhappy childhood, seems like the type of protagonist in a fairy tale who starts off living in misery, but will eventually win fame, fortune, and love after going on adventures and proving his compassion and bravery. James and Sirius, the arrogant and wealthy young purebloods, seem more like wicked stepsister--er, stepbrother--material than heroes. In fact, if you change the details just a little, you wind up with Harry in place of Snape, and Draco in place of James and Sirius.

It seemed like JKR was deliberately setting up parallels between these two characters, and also with Tom Riddle/Voldemort, but the similarities between Harry and Snape are the strongest of the three. I was certain that we were going to see some kind of confrontation and rapprochement between them by the end of the series. John Granger, who wrote "The Hidden Key to Harry Potter" (along with a number of other Potter-related books), believed that Snape had been in love with Lily, and that his and Harry's mutual love for her would eventually enable them to work together and respect each other, and maybe even become friends. (I'm paraphrasing, since I seem to have misplaced my copy of the book, but I remember that the author believed there would be a reconciliation between Harry and Snape, once Harry realized that Snape was working on his behalf for Lily's sake.)

The book was written well before the end of the series; I believe it was post-GoF but pre-OotP, so Mr. Granger had good intuition about Snape and Lily, without even having the benefit of the hints laid out in the Snape's Worst Memory scene. He was wrong about there being a true reconciliation, though, since Snape did not live long enough to achieve one.

It's true that Harry almost immediately changed his opinion of Snape after viewing the flask of memories, at least once the shock of learning that he had to sacrifice himself wore off. He defended Snape to Voldemort, loudly proclaiming him to be Dumbledore's man. He named his youngest son partly after Snape, and told young Albus Severus that Snape was the bravest man he ever knew. If you count interviews with the author as part of canon, then we're told that Harry even made sure that Snape got his Headmaster's portrait at Hogwarts.

However, this felt unsatisfying to me, because it's all too easy to forgive and praise a conveniently dead martyr, rather than to have to make peace with the living man, with all his warts (figuratively speaking) and snark. It doesn't really cost Harry anything to laud a dead hero; he doesn't have to acknowledge mixed feelings and old resentments, or awkwardness about the idea of Snape loving Lily. He doesn't have to apologize to Snape for doubting his loyalties or thank Snape for protecting him, and he doesn't have to work at attempting a reconciliation with a Snape who might feel angry and embarrassed about having his private thoughts revealed, and who might not be gracious about accepting apologies or thanks.

There's a hint in the post-DH interviews that perhaps Harry doesn't want to acknowledge any mixed feelings or seek a reconciliation with Snape: JKR says that he never went to speak with Snape's portrait, which seems rather curious to me. Even if the portrait isn't the real Snape, wouldn't Harry want to pay tribute to the man who had protected him and remained Dumbledore's true man by expressing his thanks to the portrait, since he couldn't thank the real man? Didn't he want to learn more about Lily's childhood from Snape? (Although I'm not quite sure how far the portrait's memories and knowledge would extend. JKR said that they're very limited, and yet Phineas Nigellus seems to be very autonomous and capable of independent thought.) And didn't Harry want to confront Snape about the way that Snape had treated him unfairly over the years (whether the unfairness is perceived or real; I think it's a mixture of both) because Harry resembled his father so closely, something that was beyond Harry's control and hardly his fault. Even if he knows Snape is a good guy, long-standing resentments and hurt feelings are not so easily forgotten. With Snape dead, maybe it was easier for Harry to set aside those feelings and not have to look too closely at them. It's easier to see only the good side of a deceased hero when he isn't around to reawaken old grievances with his abrasive personality.

Neither does Snape have to reconcile his hatred for James versus his love for Lily in the single person of Harry. He doesn't have to acknowledge that maybe there is more Lily in Harry than he had thought, and maybe, just maybe, he has developed some fondness for the boy, as Dumbledore suggested.

I really wanted to see that post-war confrontation and/or reconciliation between Harry and Snape, so I felt cheated when I didn't get it. I certainly didn't expect them to hug each other at the end or anything, but I thought there would be a mutual acknowledgement of respect for each other. I could picture Harry awkwardly but earnestly trying to apologize to and thank Snape, who would be embarrassed about Harry seeing his memories, and brusquely brush off Harry's well-meant words. Harry in turn might bristle at this apparent slight of his good intentions, maybe grumble that Snape is still a bit of a git, but nevertheless, he'd do everything within his power to clear Snape's name and see that his heroism was made public. (Whether the public would actually accept this or not is another matter.)

Regarding Snape, I've been wondering ever since reading OotP if he might have some deeply hidden sympathy for Harry. I wondered if he knew about Umbridge's punishment with the quill pen that cut lines into Harry's hand, and if so, what he thought about it. Although he frequently gives his students a verbal tongue-lashing or gives them nasty detentions like bedpan-scrubbing, he never inflicts a physical punishment on them, and it was my gut instinct that he would be angered at this abuse of a child, even a child that he didn't like. I think this is confirmed by the way that he tries to shield Luna, Ginny, and Neville by giving them detention with Hagrid instead of the Carrows in DH. I think that if possible, he would have protected Harry from Umbridge's detention (maybe disguising his intentions by claiming to give Harry a "worse" detention, like dissecting some sort of slimy creature for potion ingredients), but he wasn't able to do so without blowing his cover with the Death Eaters. If that was the case, it must have been frustrating for him, another example of someone he was unable to protect.

And there is the fact that Harry had a miserable childhood in which he was neglected and emotionally abused by his aunt and uncle. I don't know if Snape knew about the exact circumstances of Harry's home life, though I suspect that he didn't. Dumbledore convinced him that he should protect Harry for Lily's sake, so he probably would have objected--for Lily's sake, if not Harry's--if he knew that Dumbledore was letting her child be abused. Still, if he knew that Harry was being raised by Petunia, he could probably figure out that she wouldn't be the kindest of guardians to Lily's child.

Probably he tried not to think about it too much, especially before Harry came to Hogwarts and it was easier to ignore. Dwelling on thoughts of Lily's child would remind Snape of his guilt over the part he played in her death. And after Harry arrived at Hogwarts looking like a young James, Snape probably wanted to have a good excuse to hate him. If he could convince himself that Harry was a spoiled brat instead of a neglected child, he wouldn't have to feel sympathy for the boy.

But deep down, maybe deep enough to be hidden from his conscious thoughts, I suspect he knew that Harry's childhood wasn't really all that pleasant; he just didn't want to admit it. If he ever did confront that realization, I think that he would feel some grudging sympathy, which would in turn make him uncomfortable and resentful because it would again remind him of his guilt (because it's his fault that Harry is an orphan--or so he believes), because he doesn't want to feel sympathy for James's son, and also because it would remind him of his own unhappy childhood.

Even if he did manage to recognize that he and Harry are more alike than he'd care to admit, I don't really see him apologizing to Harry for any past mistreatment; it's just not in his character. I don't see him bonding with Harry over Lily's memory, either. But I can see him giving Harry a grudging acknowledgment of respect, perhaps a simple, "You did well, Potter." And perhaps he'd mask it with a bit of sarcastic humor: "You didn't do too badly for a reckless Gryffindor, Potter." (In one of my fanfics, Snape magnanimously grants Gryffindor five points on Harry's behalf for "saving the world".) By this point, I would hope, Harry would have gained enough perception to recognize the praise as genuine, however grudging or sarcastically phrased, and in spite of his mixed feelings for Snape, he would feel proud that he had finally won that hard-earned praise from his toughest teacher and former enemy. And hopefully he would finally recognize and acknowledge how much Snape had taught him, even if Snape brushed off his thanks.

They would never become bosom buddies (in my fantasy, anyway; you Snarry shippers out there might have a different one ^_^), but they would gradually grow more comfortable with each other over the years. They would continue bickering with and insulting each other, but after awhile, it would take on an almost affectionate air, and they would enjoy having a good argument or debate with each other from time to time.

Of course I didn't expect JKR to follow my vision exactly, but I felt like the series had been leading up to a final confrontation between Snape and Harry, and that portion of the story sort of ended with a fizzle instead of a bang, at least for me. They spend most of the final book far apart from each other, and when Harry finally does see Snape towards the end, he isn't really able to speak with Snape before he dies. He does get to see Snape's memories posthumously, but he's a passive observer, unable to interact with Snape-in-the-past.

Even if Snape had died before he and Harry had a chance to reconcile with each other, I could accept it more easily if we could see Harry's grief and frustration that he'll never be able to resolve things with Snape. I recall reading a fanfic on Ink Stained Fingers that dealt partially with this theme; unfortunately, I've forgotten the title, but I think it might have been a Harry/Draco story. Anyway, in this story, Voldemort discovers that Snape is a traitor and kills him, sending what's left of him (implying that he died a very painful and gruesome death) back to Dumbledore, and both Harry and Draco feel angry and cheated that they didn't know Snape's true loyalties before he died and that they'll never have a chance to confront him about it.

If I could have seen that sort of frustration, that sense of lack of closure in canon, I think the ending of the book would have rung more true to me. Instead, Harry seems to shift immediately from "Snape's a mean, traitorous bastard" to "Snape's a hero because he loved my mum" without any qualms or second thoughts. It feels as if things have been prettied up, Snape made over into a brave and noble hero (and he is a hero, but he's also more than that), and any conflicting feelings that Harry might have were swept under the rug where he doesn't have to deal with them.

And even though Snape died, Harry might still have gotten a measure of closure from Snape's portrait, which presumably would have some of his personality and could give Harry some insights into the real man.

But he doesn't seek out this closure. Maybe JKR never regarded Snape's part of the story with same level of importance as we do, except to illustrate how Harry differed from Snape, in being able to overcome his unfortunate childhood--because he is a Gryffindor, I suspect, although obviously there are a lot of other factors involved. Harry had the protection of his mother's love and the knowledge that she loved him enough to sacrifice herself for him, and he had two loyal and loving friends who stood by him through thick and thin (well, there was Ron's brief defection, but that was caused by the horcrux, and he did later return to Harry's side). Snape, on the other hand, had parents who seemed more interested in fighting with each other than taking care of him (we see no evidence of any love or affection, although we can't definitively say that they didn't love him), and his childhood friend eventually abandoned him--with some justification, it can be argued, given the "Mudblood" incident, but I think it was clear that they were already growing apart and that she was feeling pressure from her Gryffindor friends to drop him.

Or maybe it was just that the author wanted Harry to have his happy ending without any of the complications that coming to a true sense of understanding with Snape would require. Personally, I would have liked to have seen the joy and triumph of winning the war tempered with a little anger and sorrow. I don't think that it would have detracted from the victory, but rather, made it all the more precious by acknowledging that it had been won due to the sacrifices of those who had fallen in battle--and in Snape's case, what essentially amounts to the sacrifice of nearly two decades of his life spent living as a spy and constantly being reminded of his guilt, whether he survived the war or not.
  • Harry and Severus, part I

    Excellent post! I hope you don't mind a long-winded answer. ;-)

    It seemed like JKR was deliberately setting up parallels between these two characters

    Agreed, but I think that was done to demonstrate how special Harry was. And similarly, the fact that he had friends who stuck by him while Snape did not was intended to show how special Gryffindors were and how terrible Slytherins were---that Slytherins could not even manage to develop lasting friendships. The one "friendship" Severus had, many insist, was destroyed solely by Snape's ambition and greed; in contrast, Lily's ambition was pure, wholesome, and just, we are told. Throughout the series, thought and ambition are considered bad, unless it's pedestrian or negative ambition. So Lily's ambition for a prosperous, sexy husband is good, as is Sirius Black's purely negative ambition to reject his family and the Dark.

    We are meant to see the difference in Lily's, Harry's and Snape's paths as an indication of something lacking in Snape, and that deficit means that Harry is not required to attempt any reconciliation. Snape has, after all, demonstrated with Lily that he is not capable of reconciliation, but merely supplication and abasement -- yet another of his choices that elicit disdain and condemnation.

    As you say, Harry never needs to apologize to Snape for doubting his loyalties or thank Snape for protecting him, and he doesn't have to work at attempting a reconciliation etc. Again, I agree, but I think that in the view of many, Harry takes the position of Lily and no apology or thanks (to Snape) are necessary. Snape's actions are not praiseworthy in any way, they insist, because while Snape repeatedly saved Harry and sacrificed his existence for Harry, that is only as it should be and, in fact, Snape should be chastised for not "liking Harry" and being "nice" while he did it. It is a remarkably juvenile, harsh and -- dare I say it -- un-Christian attitude, but it does seem prevelant outside Snape World. I say juvenile because it sticks to a black and white view of the world, which requires heroes to be "pure" and all "good" (sound like any post-DH interviews about Harry's goodness)?

    That attitude is, IMO, strongly demonstrated in interviews with the author, in which her readers dragged her almost literally kicking and screaming into grudgingly acknowledging that Snape might have some positive attributes and an important role in the story. The emotional turmoil and struggle you describe for Harry was, I think, played out for all of us across two continents and several months after DH, as the audiences (at least in one location) not only challenged the relentlessly negative comments about Snape with questions, but audibly groaned at their repetition. ;-)

    But to (try to) be fair, much of the emphasis on Snape's role comes from a very detailed book analysis and fandom. Going back through the books, one is struck by just how little "page time" Snape has. Which is a rather remarkable demonstration, really, of what a vivid character Rowling created. And while at least some corners of fandom have firmly established Snape as a pivotal character, it is not all that clear that he was in the mind of his creator. IOW, we never see in the books that Snape's spying had any positive contribution to the war effort, and all of Voldy's defeats are directly attributable to Gryffindor "pluck" and "nerve". Even the first defeat, that many attribute that Voldy's agreement to spare Lily if possible (and what an irony that is --g--), does not redound to Snape's credit according to many. In fact, the mere necessity of the agreement was due to Snape's action in repeating the prophecy, so once again, Harry certainly should not need to apologize for that.

    And so, Harry's actions in getting the portrait (if we are going to adopt interviews as canon) are simply more demonstrations of how wonderful Harry is, in "forgiving" a horrible person, rather than any indication that the horrible person might have any redeeming qualities (well, except for the one of bravery, which apparently only Gryffindors are allowed credit for and which Harry grudgingly acknowledges).
    • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

      Excellent post! I hope you don't mind a long-winded answer. ;-)

      Please, be as long-winded as you like! ^_^

      We are meant to see the difference in Lily's, Harry's and Snape's paths as an indication of something lacking in Snape, and that deficit means that Harry is not required to attempt any reconciliation.

      This really makes me sad, but I suspect that you're right. I know that it's been mentioned many other times on this community, but I still don't understand how JKR managed to create such a complex, sympathetic, and 3-dimensional character when she appears to see him as shallow and unlikeable. But as you said, we've spent a lot of time doing very detailed analysis of the relatively limited "page time" Snape has. On the other hand, even the young kids in that Today show interview got that Snape was a hero.

      Snape's actions are not praiseworthy in any way, they insist, because while Snape repeatedly saved Harry and sacrificed his existence for Harry, that is only as it should be and, in fact, Snape should be chastised for not "liking Harry" and being "nice" while he did it. It is a remarkably juvenile, harsh and -- dare I say it -- un-Christian attitude...

      No argument here. It seems really contradictory to the message that the story promotes about love being so important. I think my definition of love and the Potter-universe definition are two very different things. The latter seems to be rather limited and small-minded.
      • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

        I should have added that a generous picture of love is not exclusive to any one religion (or lack thereof). I mention Christianity specifically because the author has claimed membership in that faith. Plus, I'm still annoyed over the insistence by many that HP is a Christian story, when so many of its core elements (judgement, lack of forgiveness, nonreconciliation, bigotry, etc) -- which we see played large in Snape's story -- are the antithesis.
      • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

        (Anonymous)
        No argument here. It seems really contradictory to the message that the story promotes about love being so important. I think my definition of love and the Potter-universe definition are two very different things. The latter seems to be rather limited and small-minded.

        Yeah. It's more about purity of intent than trying to create a good result or managing to do the right thing in the context of a complex situation. Even Harry's march to his death is all about making a statement and offering himself as a martyr, and ending his connection with Voldemort. It's not an action that fixes the situation, and it's not planned well or thought out at all.

        Just meaning well is enough, and your impact on the world is secondary.
    • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

      I do agree with you, as you know, but I have, I'm afraid, another essay in me concerning Severus Snape. It will focus on the Beatitudes. You see, everyone has defined the conflict in the books as that between love and death. or love and power. I think the true conflict is between love and the fear of death - and whose love is actually victorious here? If you really think about it, Severus, and only Severus, is the victor.

      That is actually what Rowling wrote. Lily's love for Harry was (I insist) no more special than ALice Longbottom's for Neville, or that German mother's for her children. What mattered was that she actually had a choice as to whether she lived or died. Only Snape's love for her gave her that choice.

      So, Rowling may have intended Severus as a minor character, simply a catalyst for the action, but that is actually not what she wrote.

      Good essay, Geri! I do think the lack of resolution between these two characters, and the lack of any real growth in Harry, is by far the most frustrating thing in these very frustrating books.
      • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

        I'll be looking forward to your essay! It sounds interesting, and I was kind of disappointed in how the "power of love" concept turned out in the books.

        Good point about Lily. In the past I recall people wondering why Lily's sacrifice was so special, when surely there had been other mothers who died to protect their children, and it turned out that the choice was what made the difference. Although I'm not sure that I buy Harry's sacrifice providing a sort of blanket protection over all the Hogwarts defenders. That seemed to be stretching the sacrifice/protection concept a little too far.
        • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

          Oh, Harry's sacrifice and the protection of Hogwarts? Someone - either Cardigrl, Terri Testing, or Jodel - came up with the solution there. Harry's sacrifice, such as it was, wasn't effectual at all. It was Snape's that mattered! But more on this later
          • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

            It was not I. I don't know who first propounded the theory.
        • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

          surely there had been other mothers who died to protect their children, and it turned out that the choice was what made the difference

          The idealization (to the point of absurdity) of motherhood in a series that claims to be adult and dark has always annoyed me. Every single mother who has sacrificed for her child has made a choice. And for those who say it is not at all remarkable, or that all mothers would do the same, I can point them to thousands of children caught in the system because their parents did not choose to see they got food and other necessities, let alone making a choice to die for them.
    • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

      (Anonymous)
      I must say, you have made an excellent point..See recently i started revisiting my harry potter obsession and i had this realization of what a great character Snape is and while looking for analysis/essays on his character, i found your essay and i completely agree..
      Don't get me wrong, I love the books but I think there should have some sort of interaction, some sort of redemption of the relationship between snape and harry other then harry praising snape to his kid...I mean their relationship has been one of the most complex relationships through out the books..Harry always distrusting snape, bad mouthing him and in a way, just making him this one dimensional evil character..He never could understand how dumbledore or even lupin had even a ounce of respect for him..AND Snape was in this perplexing situation where he knew that Harry was lily's son but could not forget how James was also the father..
      Though I personally think Harry was more like Lily, snape just could'nt see past his hatred for James and yet he was forced to protect Harry. Forced to protect the son of the man he detested and the woman he loved..Forced to be a double agent and putting himself in mortal danger for a boy who hated him as much..I bet it was an uphill battle that he fought everyday..
      So seeing all their issues with each other, I honestly hoped for at least one conversation between both of them..I mean i di'dnt expect them to best friends but just one acknowledgement from Harry, saying - Thank you..Or saying I was wrong..or just regret on how he like everyone else in Snape's lives totally misjudged him..
      And even in death, Snape died alone without anyone who cared about him around..At least dumbledore chose his own death..And a death that was given to him almost as a mercy killing from one of his trusted friends..and with his favorite student around..When dumbledore died, the whole magical community cried..When Snape died, no one was around to shed a tear for him..
      I personally feel that JKR took the easy way out, she did'nt know how to have that redeeming conversation between Snape and Harry..And about the part after the pensieve, yes i do wish that Harry had for one moment well regret and reflected on snape but i guess I understand that at that point, the only important thing was that He had to die for LV to die..His death was such an impending issue that I don't think there was any time to think about snape..But maybe through the hallow, if he could have just apologized to snape or forget that..Just after the war, while going to dumbledore's office, if he had just told dumbledore how much he regrets his attitude towards Snape..Anything other then that one line in the epilogue 19 YEARS LATER!! it almost seems like a disrespect to not acknowledge one of the key characters in Harry's victory right after the war..but like 19 years later..And I think after 17 years of seeing Harry and Snape's weird relationship, we deserved some sort of a closure through words and feelings rather then actions such as giving your son "severus" as his middle name..I would have been ok without that..Actions are important but sometimes the hardest thing is acknowledging someone's contribution with words and on a emotional level..Its easier to misconstrue actions. I guess in the end, I hope that somewhere beyond Lily does interact with Snape and thanks him and tells him that some part of her did love him...Another point, i wish we had seen more of lily's feelings towards snape, something that told us that Lily did care about snape at some point as much as he did if not more!!!Anyways Rant over and I am sorry this is long..actually maybe not, a character as complex and multilayered as Snape desreves a long post..hehe
      • Re: Harry and Severus, part I

        No need for apologies--I'm always glad when my own ramblings inspire some discussion about Snape! ;-) It's been awhile since the series ended, but I still regret that we never got to see that final reconciliation between Harry and Snape, or as you said, at least some kind of expression of regret from Harry after Snape died.

        I would have liked to have seen more of Lily and Snape, too. I guess JKR probably didn't want to detract too much from the main story, so we only got one chapter of flashbacks in The Prince's Tale, but I didn't get the impression of a very close and deep friendship from those brief scenes. It felt more like they bonded because they were the only two magical children in their neighborhood, and drifted apart once they got to Hogwarts and made other friends, and maybe discovered that they didn't have much in common besides being wizards. I'd like to think that they reconcile in the afterlife and that Lily is grateful to Snape for protecting Harry.
  • Harry and Severus, Part II

    It was a little surprising that the potential development you describe, in which Snape is forced to realize and acknowledge that he misjudged Harry for years due to his hatred of James, never happened. Because I agree, that Snape most likely struggled, at least subconsciously, about that. I found its absence extremely disappointing and depressing, because I suspect that we are meant to accept that Snape was being forthright in Dumbledore's office when he sidestepped the accusation of having learned to care for Harry and, instead, implied it was all and always for Lily.

    Where does that leave us, and why is that depressing? It leaves us in a worldview in which Harry Potter is exceptionally good because he is the only character ever willing or able to admit they might have been even remotely able to change and reexamine their prejudices and preconceptions. Snape is not, and so there could never be any kind of reconciliation or resolution. The world of fanfic is wonderful, because it contains all the reconciliation one could want between Harry and Draco, Harry and Severus, Hermione and Severus, Hermione and Draco, Ron and Draco, etc, etc. But that is fanfic; it's not the world that Rowling wrote. OTOH, perhaps we should be encouraged, that so many seek the reconciliation in fanfic.
    • Re: Harry and Severus, Part II

      It was a little surprising that the potential development you describe, in which Snape is forced to realize and acknowledge that he misjudged Harry for years due to his hatred of James, never happened.

      Yes, I really wanted to see this, almost as much as I wanted to see Harry acknowledge that he'd misjudged Snape. And I'm surprised, as it seems like JKR would want Snape to admit that he'd wronged hero-Harry. Or maybe the fact that he can't is supposed to be proof of his faults, and part of the reason why Harry doesn't need to apologize to him?

      I found its absence extremely disappointing and depressing, because I suspect that we are meant to accept that Snape was being forthright in Dumbledore's office when he sidestepped the accusation of having learned to care for Harry and, instead, implied it was all and always for Lily

      You know, it seemed so obvious to me that Snape was evading the question, since he doesn't directly deny it. He implies it pretty strongly, of course, but I thought that the lack of a "No, I don't care about him" meant that Snape felt, if not exactly fondness, something more than hatred for Harry. But maybe that's just me as a Snape fan reading more into it than the author intended.
      • Re: Harry and Severus, Part II

        You know, it seemed so obvious to me that Snape was evading the question

        Same here. I was surprised that a lot of readers took it at face value, and that (if I recall correctly) JKR said that Severus hated Harry until the day he died. I took the vehement "Expecto Patronum!" as a deflection of attention, because Severus had let the mask slip and had almost revealed something resembling a positive emotion towards the "despised" Harry. ;-) I also inferred that Severus had done some self-reflection and growth that last year, between the confrontation with Dumbledore and the scene in the Shrieking Shack where he (so I interpreted it, at least) wants Harry to look at him and see him as the ally he really is, past the role he had to play as a spy.

        But maybe that's just me as a Snape fan reading more into it than the author intended.

        Everyone I've talked to in real life read it the same way, so I think it has less to do with being a Snape fan than with the reasonable apparent reading of the text as a whole. And maybe with general reader expectations of the significance of the Severus-Harry story arc, i.e., the whole coming-of-age, getting-past-misunderstanding-and-mutual-dislike sort of thing into some kind of resolution and respect/changed views.

        • Re: Harry and Severus, Part II

          Well, I'm glad that other people feel the same way that I do. It often seems to me that what JKR wrote and what she intended are two completely different things.
        • Re: Harry and Severus, Part II

          (Anonymous)
          Yeah! I just wish that she'd given us that story arc a bit more explicitly. It's very ambiguous the way she left it. I wonder if it's different viewing the film?

          The ambiguity just detracted from the emotional resonance in the book. The Lily eyes thing was moving in a way, but it was the only moving moment in a very, very long book. Well, Harry's death scene was moderately moving, but hard to take seriously.




      • Re: Harry and Severus, Part II

        He implies it pretty strongly, of course, but I thought that the lack of a "No, I don't care about him" meant that Snape felt, if not exactly fondness, something more than hatred for Harry.

        It could be read that he did not find it necessary to repeat how much he despised Harry. What struck me was that Snape had never been shy about saying it in the past, and so the fact that he did not put in a barb about Harry was significant. Perhaps too much Jane Austen in my past. What was that line? Having abused me to my face, I did not think you would be shy about doing it to my friends? Or something like that. ;-)

        People critical of Snape, however, could easily point to this as yet another instance of Snape being all about Snape, in the same way that they view Snape's question to Dumbles, "What about my soul?" as an indication that he is entirely selfish. Of course, my own reading of that was of a last, desperate plea for someone, anyone, to acknowledge his worth as a human being.

        But to get back to the scene in Dumbledore's office and the claim that Snape died hating Harry, I attribute that to overweening sentimentality. The idea that you can love someone and still not like them, or everything they do, perhaps escapes many people. And, too, the view that "good" and "nice" equate, as do "love" and "sappiness", are rife. ;-) For those who espouse those views, the idea that Snape could love anyone is absurd.
    • Re: Harry and Severus, Part II

      (Anonymous)
      Do you think she didn't notice moments he could have admitted that? She's said she doesn't reread her own work, so she might have just forgotten that there are moments in which he might have seen Harry as someone other than evil little James 2.

      I don't think I'd mind so much if it weren't for what you say - Harry is exceptionally good because he is the only character ever willing or able to admit they might have been remotely able to change and reexamine their prejudices and preconceptions. If ONE character did that, or attempted it, the story would make more sense. I mean, it's a hard thing to do, but you'd think wizards would at least try, on occasion at least.
  • Yes,this was one of the great disappointments of book 7,the lacking reconciliation between Snape and Harry.From GoF on I was sure that in the end it would come to a confrontation ending in a mutual ackknowledgement of respect.I even imagined that Harry would recognize earlier in book 7 Snape's true loyalties and that they would work and fight together-however grudgingly-until LV is defeated.Not necessary that they love or even like each other but recognize each other for what they are.But of course with a ending like this,a reconciliatory one,Snape would not be the tragic hero who made a mess of his whole life,and maybe we would not love him so much in this case as we do now....
    • Yes, that's exactly how I had pictured it--a sort of grudging respect and alliance between them. As for Snape being a tragic hero...maybe, but personally I thought it was tragic enough that he'd lost his best friend and caused her death, without him needing to die, too. But I have had a big soft spot for him ever since the Snape's Worst Memory scene, so I really wanted to see him find a little happiness in the end.
    • While I would have enjoyed seeing them consciously working together, I did not really expect that in book 7. I did, though, expect the grudging respect you describe. I would love the character either way, I think. But as you say, perhaps many would not...
    • lacking conciliation

      (Anonymous)
      I really expected some conciliation between them after 4 as well. He should have recognized by that point that he had been wrong about Snape. And he should have started to realize, or had someone point out to him, that Snape is often right about things.

      I got the sense, though, that JKR doesn't want us to see Harry or Dumbledore as in any way responsible for Cedric's death, even though there are clear warning signs which they ignore. It's a complicated situation because Snape does not guess the impostor is evil either, but he comes closer than anybody else to recognizing this. I think he was a little afraid of Moody.
  • Great meta, as always. Just to let you know: there's a reply over on the snced site: http://syndicated.livejournal.com/snapedom_syn/105818.html?nc=1
    • Thanks, glad you enjoyed the essay! I'll head over and take a look at the reply.
  • This was very good. I agree with everything you said. I just wanted to add something you said which made me laugh out loud.

    (In one of my fanfics, Snape magnanimously grants Gryffindor five points on Harry's behalf for "saving the world".)

    Now that's funny!
    • Thanks, I'm glad that you liked the essay, and that I was able to make you laugh! I always thought that if by some miracle, Snape ever did give Harry points, he'd do it in a completely sarcastic manner. ^_^
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