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My question is about Snape's ability to fly in DH. McGongall believes Voldemort taught him but he didn't fly away in HBP, instead running until he reached the gate then Apparated. So did he not know at that point or was his ability suppressed in some way? Is there more that just plot convenience involved? What was your reaction when you read that passage?
I include a passage because I recall discussions post-DH wondering whether he literally flies at all.
Deathly Hallows, US HB p.599 "He jumped," said Professor McGonagall as Harry and Luna ran into the room.
"You mean he's dead?" Harry sprinted to the window, ignoring Flitwaick's and Sprout's yells of shock at his sudden appearance.
"No, he's not dead," said McGonagall bitterly. "Unlike Dumbledore, he was still carrying a wand . . . and he seems to have learned a few tricks from his master."
With a tingle of horror, Harry saw in the distance a huge, batlike shape flying through the darkness toward the perimeter wall.
I include a passage because I recall discussions post-DH wondering whether he literally flies at all.
Deathly Hallows, US HB p.599 "He jumped," said Professor McGonagall as Harry and Luna ran into the room.
"You mean he's dead?" Harry sprinted to the window, ignoring Flitwaick's and Sprout's yells of shock at his sudden appearance.
"No, he's not dead," said McGonagall bitterly. "Unlike Dumbledore, he was still carrying a wand . . . and he seems to have learned a few tricks from his master."
With a tingle of horror, Harry saw in the distance a huge, batlike shape flying through the darkness toward the perimeter wall.
Other than that, maybe it's an ancient spell that he discovered in the Hogwarts library or Malfoy Manor?
Personally, I think it was a plot convenience for JKR, and I could do without most of DH.
My pet theory is that it wasn't Voldemort who taught Severus how to fly but the other way around. Severus developed unsupported flight sometime in the years between 1981 and Voldemort's re-embodiment based on his memories of Lily flying off the swing. He always preferred this to brooms, but he kept it secret, though Dumbledore may have known. When Voldemort came back Severus needed ways to regain Voldemort's favor. And perhaps Dumbledore wanted Severus to keep Voldemort busy with something not particularly useful. So perhaps Severus spent a lot of his time as DE giving Voldemort flying lessons (Master, it would look a lot more impressive if you did it this way'). Kept him from being assigned anything too nasty (besides the inevitable), kept him in Voldemort's good books (in case gossip about Dumbledore wasn't juicy enough). Though a flying Voldemort was a travesty to Lily's memory it was a useless enough skill most of the time, more for show than for substance, that it slowed Voldemort down more often than not, so in a way it was Lily still fighting from beyond the grave.
(I think the only cases where unaided flying was useful to Voldemort were when he was flying in a space that was protected against both Apparition and supported flight, such as the Horcrux cave and possibly Nurmegrad prison.)
- Oryx
that Severus either flew a thestral or escaped in thestral Animagus form.
- Oryx
Learning To Fly by SavineSnape
http://owl.tauri.org/stories.php?sid=77
Flying
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3931239/1/Fl
In it, I examine the commonly-held notion that V. taught S. to fly. Why not the other way around? Such experimentation to learn something unique and unusual seemed to me very much a part of Severus's mind-set.
Alison
Re: Flying
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(That was me, Oryx, both times)
Re: Flying
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BTW when Harry's rescue task-force arrives in DH chapter 4 Harry doesn't see them until they undo the disillusionments. Also Crabbe and Goyle outside the Room of Requirement go unnoticed. So normal disillusionment provides a reasonable level of concealment, at least to a casual observer.
- Oryx
Re: Flying
That’s fine and that is your way. Because interviews don’t confirm anything for me, they are just another way to look at the text. And more than likely I’ve read or heard the interviews JKR has given. When I’m asking questions, I’m not looking for an answer but different views. I enjoy hearing what others have to say no matter how crazy it might sound to some. This is what is great about fiction. My fear steams from being on a forum where threads would be shut down with, “Jo said.”
At many points flying represents freedom, but I would say that as the issues of good/evil become more gray in the books and Harry struggles to understand (Snape turns out to be good and motivated by live, Dumbledore turns out to be more manipulative and affected by being spurned than he thought, Narcissa turns out to be the key, etc...) it was necessary thematically for it not to be as simple as "only good guys and good creatures fly". In fact I would say that many things in DH are deliberately done to turn certain assumptions from the previous books on their heads. I haven't written an extensive essay about it, but I probably could come up with some other things that fit this, too (water often seems to represent evil and danger in the earlier books and this too begins to change, perhaps...)
Anyway, it's stated specifically in Quidditch through the Ages that broom flight was invented because wizards could not fly without assistance, but that other things could be charmed to fly, like carpets. One assumes that Voldemort came up with a way to charm his garments to flight, and that he taught Severus the trick.
McGonagall can't know anything about who taught who to fly; it's just her opinion. I believe that Lily really was flying from her swing, and Severus further developed the charm sharing it with the Dark Lord to gain his favor. The reverse makes no sense to me -- why would Voldie share something so fantastic?
Jo's interviews are very dodgy as far as I'm concerned; she uses post-book interviews to explain things that should have been clear in the narrative. Come to think of it, her comments often contradict the narrative!! lol
Another inconsistency is the same book, p.580 UK edition:
"Harry's hand closed on Cedric's wrist; one tombstone stood between him and Voldemort, but Cedric was too heavy to carry, and the cup was out of reach -
Voldrmort's red eyes flamed in the darkness. Harry saw his mouth curl into a smile, saw him raise his wand.
'Accio!' Harry yelled, pointing his wand at the Triwizard Cup.
It flew into the air, and soared towards him - Harry caught it by the handle - "
This has long irritated me. We are expected to believe Harry has three hands? Or that he lets go of either Cedric or his wand to catch the Cup? But no, he arrives back at Headqu...Hogwarts, with all three. So how did he manage it? Those two examples are the sorts of accidents I'd read and forgive in a fanfic, but in a book that was supposedly properly written and edited, they grate.
Alison
I am wondering if any of the memories in The Prince's Tale will change order. As it is now, Snape visited 12GP (when he took Lily's photograph and the end of her letter) after the battle of the seven Potters, which was the battle in which Moody died, so it must have been after Moody cast his protective spells. In interviews she claimed Snape came before those spells were cast. Personally I prefer the way the book stands now because it means Snape was capable of overcoming Moody's protections and the reason the secret of 12GP remained intact wasn't Moody's spell but Snape's intent to keep it that way.
Regarding who taught whom to fly: Voldemort likes to brag in front of the DEs with how unique his knowledge is. For example in GOF he hints about the Horcruxes and brags that the resurrection process involved spells and potions of his own invention - but of course he never taught any of them how to do any of it (I doubt even Pettigrew was told the entire resurrection process, I bet Voldemort kept some crucial step secret). Flying unaided is rare enough to impress the DEs, it seems like something he would keep to himself. OTOH in HBP Bellatrix boasted that she had learned Dark Arts from Voldemort himself. So perhaps it was his custom to teach the occasional neat trick to his favorite DE and teaching his new skill to Severus, and to him alone, emphasized Severus' elevated status among the DEs. Also, Severus was being sent to Hogwarts, a place protected against Apparition - exactly where the flying skill can be useful.
I still prefer to see Severus as the inventor of unaided flight, because of the connection with Lily's early magic, probably Severus' happiest memory ever.
- Oryx
That's a cool idea, but surely wizards would have thought of that already if they'd a history of charming other objects to fly?
She implies in QUidditch Through the Ages that flying charms are not that simple to do, which is why everyone doesn't just make their own broom, but relies on the broom manufacturers to do it for them. But I liked the theory someone put forth above, that it was Lily Evans who had the knack for flying charms, even in her pre-Hogwarts magic, and she taught them to Snape.
That I've *got* to see. Wouldn't a harness have to be involved..?