InsaneJournal

Tweak says, "Hello, pumpkin!"

drsevarius (drsevarius) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-09-04 14:44:00

Entry tags:

char: batgirl/oracle/barbara gordon, char: batman/bruce wayne, char: joker, char: robin/nightwing/dick grayson, char: starfire/koriand'r, creator: joe bennett, creator: marc andreyko

Dick and Babs: Awkward!

This is from Nightwing Annual #2 by Marc Andreyko and Joe Bennett

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	beastman12010 2009-09-04 06:54 pm UTC (link)
	That last page... Dickdickery? (Reply to this)

	sistermagpie 2009-09-04 06:56 pm UTC (link)
	Oh god, no. Not the 2-timing retcon. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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nezchan, 2009-09-05 12:55 am UTC

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ashtoreth, 2009-09-05 01:39 am UTC

	runespoor7 2009-09-04 07:05 pm UTC (link)
	As far as I'm concerned, the last page and a half of this otherwise decent sequence never existed. It's like, Andreyko, what were you thinking Dick would be thinking? (Has Dick ever been implied to be anything else than strictly monogamous?) (Reply to this)

jaybee3
2009-09-04 07:05 pm UTC (link)

Ooh, Dick looks really bad here. Forget what he did to Barbara (they did after all get together after this so she must have) but he cheated on Kory - and you know what, that seems out of character no matter how much or how long he's loved Babs.

I know Dick's gotten a reputation as a player but really he's not Roy, he's always been a serial monogamist. I usually like Marc Andreyko's work (Manhunter et al.) but I don't know about this. I assume this issue is all about why she can't marry him after he proposed and all that so DC can get out of tying Dick down (which is lame since he like Wally is the settling down type). But I may have to get this issue, it seems.

That said, Joe Bennett's art looks pretty nice here.

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ashtoreth, 2009-09-05 01:41 am UTC

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bluefall, 2009-09-05 02:10 am UTC

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ashtoreth, 2009-09-05 02:46 am UTC

	icon_uk 2009-09-04 07:05 pm UTC (link)
	Bleargh! So many shades of _WRONG_ in this! (Reply to this) (Thread)

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jlroberson, 2009-09-05 12:23 am UTC

	chthonicspirit 2009-09-04 07:08 pm UTC (link)
	Just another example of what a number of posters have been discussing recently - the way good writers can have incredibly off days. Andreyko was awesome on Manhunter, but jeez louise, this just trashes about ever character that appears in it. (Reply to this)

	04nbod 2009-09-04 07:10 pm UTC (link)
	Starfire is not a favourite of mine. This is one of the reasons (Reply to this) (Thread)

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mysteryfan, 2009-09-05 01:04 am UTC

	volksjager 2009-09-04 07:13 pm UTC (link)
	Hmmm, then if you add the Batman Beyond version where Bruce and Babs hook up ,then you've got trouble. Battle Royal trouble... (Reply to this) (Thread)

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jaybee3, 2009-09-04 07:20 pm UTC

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icon_uk, 2009-09-04 07:27 pm UTC

" Who's dick grayson ?" -

volksjager, 2009-09-04 07:36 pm UTC

Re: " Who's dick grayson ?" -

icon_uk, 2009-09-04 07:52 pm UTC

Re: " Who's dick grayson ?" -

volksjager, 2009-09-04 07:53 pm UTC

Re: " Who's dick grayson ?" -

merrickm, 2009-09-04 07:57 pm UTC

Re: " Who's dick grayson ?" -

icon_uk, 2009-09-04 08:16 pm UTC

Re: " Who's dick grayson ?" -

ashtoreth, 2009-09-05 01:47 am UTC

Re: " Who's dick grayson ?" -

ladymirth, 2009-09-05 04:08 am UTC

Re: " Who's dick grayson ?" -

ashtoreth, 2009-09-05 04:32 am UTC

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jelly_ace, 2009-09-05 02:54 am UTC

I need to make a list!

parsimonia
2009-09-04 07:34 pm UTC (link)

Gaaaah, it buuurrrrnnnnss!

- "If I'd known..." if he'd known, he would've dumped Kory on the spot? Dick's not that, uh, flighty.
- Makes it seems like both Babs and Dick were just killing time being with Kory and Jason Bard. I don't know, but I really cringe at the thought of the two of them just quietly pining for each other during all that time. It seems like the point of that is to build up the scale of their romance later on, but it ends up diminishing them as individuals who had their own lives, interests and relationships apart from each other.
- Did Ollie and Dinah actually know Babs back then?? I mean, there could potentially have been a connection between Babs and Dinah, given that (I think) their fathers knew each other. But Ollie? (On the other hand, I am becoming more and more interested in seeing Babs and Ollie team up.) They might've known each other as Green Arrow and Batgirl, but...
- Ohhh the awkwardness of that "Look who's here, Babs!" panel. Bruce looks especially uncomfortable, it's hilarious.
- Gaaaaah Dick cheating on Kory with recouperating!Babs gaaaaah wrong no no no no wrong. I mean, it's out of character for Dick to be such an asshole, and part of what led up to Babs and Dick's relationship in the first place was Babs adjusting to the idea of even allowing herself a romantic/sexual relationship after being injured, because as a way of coping she decided to forget about things like that. IIRC it was the "Hunt for Oracle" storyline where they confess how they feel about each other, but she asks for time first, because she has to get used to the idea again. I don't know, I liked the fact that there had been a slower build-up, instead of them just jumping in bed together.

Pretty art, though, for the most part.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: I need to make a list! -

shadowvalkyrie, 2009-09-04 07:47 pm UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

parsimonia, 2009-09-04 07:53 pm UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

shadowvalkyrie, 2009-09-04 08:03 pm UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

parsimonia, 2009-09-04 08:10 pm UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

shadowvalkyrie, 2009-09-04 10:48 pm UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

parsimonia, 2009-09-04 10:56 pm UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

kingrockwell, 2009-09-05 03:20 am UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

parsimonia, 2009-09-05 03:18 pm UTC

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kingrockwell, 2009-09-04 08:40 pm UTC

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bluefall, 2009-09-04 09:18 pm UTC

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bluefall, 2009-09-05 12:57 am UTC

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jarodrussell, 2009-09-05 01:43 am UTC

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parsimonia, 2009-09-05 03:17 pm UTC

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kingrockwell, 2009-09-05 04:21 pm UTC

Re: I need to make a list! -

parsimonia, 2009-09-05 04:31 pm UTC

	sailorlibra 2009-09-04 07:37 pm UTC (link)
	"Babs... I don't think I can ignore the 500-pound gorilla following us." "Is Titano loose again?" In the superhero world, you really have to be careful with your metaphors. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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zordboy, 2009-09-05 03:14 am UTC

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sailorlibra, 2009-09-05 06:09 am UTC

	volksjager 2009-09-04 07:37 pm UTC (link)
	Seriously, If I were Babs and Starfire had answered the door like that I would have dropped kit and just jumped in. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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bluefall, 2009-09-04 07:46 pm UTC

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	mullon 2009-09-04 07:37 pm UTC (link)
	Joker should have sent a get well card, just for extra evil. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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volksjager, 2009-09-04 07:41 pm UTC

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thosefew, 2009-09-05 06:31 am UTC

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proteus_lives, 2009-09-05 08:54 am UTC

	bluefall 2009-09-04 07:44 pm UTC (link)
	Man, it's amazing how a dedicated and talented colorist can make Bennett's art almost tolerable. (Reply to this)

	oldmanrain 2009-09-04 07:50 pm UTC (link)
	God that's awful, poor Babs, what was his reasoning behind that? (Reply to this) (Thread)

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okkult3000, 2009-09-05 01:06 am UTC

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nagaoka, 2009-09-05 03:24 am UTC

	shadowvalkyrie 2009-09-04 07:56 pm UTC (link)
	Wow, even the dinosaur looks friendly compared to Bruce! And I agree, this story makes Dick (and to a lesser degree Kory) look bad in seriously OOC ways. And I hate "destined love ruined by misunderstandings and bad timing" storylines! They can be done well, but this is just trite. The gorilla line amused me, though. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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proteus_lives, 2009-09-05 08:55 am UTC

	harmoner 2009-09-04 08:09 pm UTC (link)
	Urgh! This issue. Never liked the Babs/Dick ship and hate this retcon. (Reply to this)

	ccsharumun 2009-09-04 08:11 pm UTC (link)
	HATE. Seriously, how hard is it to create romantic tension and drama without two-timing, love affairs, and cheating and shit? (Reply to this) (Thread)

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box_in_the_box, 2009-09-04 10:06 pm UTC

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jarodrussell, 2009-09-05 01:47 am UTC

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mysteryfan, 2009-09-05 01:02 am UTC

	jlroberson 2009-09-04 08:35 pm UTC (link)
	On one hand: Dick, you bastard. On the other--wow, she actually knew that? A writer actually remembered that? This is one of those times continuity is a good thing. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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mysteryfan, 2009-09-05 12:57 am UTC

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jlroberson, 2009-09-05 01:17 am UTC

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jlroberson, 2009-09-05 02:41 am UTC

	thebigapricot 2009-09-04 08:44 pm UTC (link)
	I always thought there should have been a coda to the last panel above where Babs states that she decided right then that she would never again be hurt by being caught off-guard and she would dedicate her life to information gathering and surveillance. What? The retcon'd everything else in this why not that? (Reply to this)

	icon_uk 2009-09-04 09:10 pm UTC (link)
	Oh, and Marv Wolfman has either, at the same time as this, or just after, confirmed that Dick wasn't a virgin when he started dating Kory. He'd had a retconned in "first experience" with a rather dull generic Asian "bad girl" named Liu, whilst he was still Robin. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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Pussycat, Pussycat, Where Have You Been? - (Anonymous), 2009-09-04 11:16 pm UTC

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parsimonia, 2009-09-04 11:51 pm UTC

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freddylloyd, 2009-09-05 06:11 pm UTC

	neuhallidae 2009-09-04 09:11 pm UTC (link)
	Gotta say, I'm impressed by the sheer size of the pile of crap in this. (Reply to this)

lyraeinne
2009-09-04 09:50 pm UTC (link)

You know, I think what bothers me most about this story is the assumption that it's actually necessary to make Dick's relationship with Kory such an issue between Dick and Babs in the first place. As if it somehow needs to be measured against (and deemed superior to) every other relationship he's ever had in order to make sense. As if Dick and Babs don't have years of friendship and love and comradeship of their own on which to build a relationship without the need for such a cheap retcon to validate it.

And those last two pages definitely have a spot somewhere in my top five things I wish I could erase from canon for all time. There's no way in which it can make sense for Dick to have such a completely callous disregard for the consequences of his actions or the feelings of either woman he's supposed to love in this instance. Not when he's been shown so many times to be someone who values his relationships with a pretty singular intensity. There's no version of Dick I've ever seen in canon for which that kind of action would make sense.

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runespoor7, 2009-09-05 05:40 pm UTC

	scottyquick 2009-09-04 09:55 pm UTC (link)
	Did anyone else here laugh at Babs' "What did you do to me, now I can't feel my legs?!"? (Reply to this) (Thread)

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shadeedge, 2009-09-04 10:01 pm UTC

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tanetris, 2009-09-06 08:30 am UTC

	freddylloyd 2009-09-04 10:23 pm UTC (link)
	Six and a half pages of jes' fine, one and a half of never happened. (Reply to this)

	zenithjolt 2009-09-05 12:07 am UTC (link)
	D: (Reply to this)

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