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skylands (skylands) wrote in scans_daily,
@ 2009-08-26 22:00:00

Current mood:	annoyed
Current music:	Balligomingo - Falling
Entry tags:	char: magog/david reid, char: wildcat/ted grant, creator: bill willingham, group: justice society of america, title: justice society of america

Justice Society of America #30
Spoilers, spoilers, and more spoilers... of nothing really interesting.

Oh, Willingham. Please tell me you're not doing what I think you're doing...

Other than that, nothing happened. Terrific's alive, Obsidian's still an egg, Stargirl's still unharmed, etc.

(Post a new comment)

	superfan1 2009-08-27 05:22 am UTC (link)
	Go wildcat,I hate that pompous jerk. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	foxhack 2009-08-27 07:26 am UTC (link)
	Motto forever. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	volksjager 2009-08-27 11:29 am UTC (link)
	I have heard that Wildcat trained Superman (among many others) how to box...is there any truth to this ???? (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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zordboy, 2009-08-27 12:18 pm UTC

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sd_mouser, 2009-08-27 12:37 pm UTC

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volksjager, 2009-08-27 01:26 pm UTC

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stolisomancer, 2009-08-27 06:26 pm UTC

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sd_mouser, 2009-08-27 06:52 pm UTC

	toasty_fresh 2009-08-27 10:09 pm UTC (link)
	Word. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	zordboy 2009-08-27 05:30 am UTC (link)
	It does seem to be subtle social commentary, though, doesn't it? Although in all honesty, I can't stand Magog either. Force feed him his teeth, Ted. ... Wait, there's a villain named "Tapeworm"? Seriously? (Reply to this) (Thread)

	skylands 2009-08-27 05:46 am UTC (link)
	Although in all honesty, I can't stand Magog either. Me neither. All his existences amounts to is DC trying to wring every damn dime they can grab out of the Kingdom Come fanboys. The fact that Magog is getting a solo when there are far more deserving characters in the DCU is grating at best. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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neuhallidae, 2009-08-27 05:50 am UTC

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skylands, 2009-08-27 05:56 am UTC

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neuhallidae, 2009-08-27 05:59 am UTC

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jaybee3, 2009-08-27 05:58 am UTC

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skylands, 2009-08-27 06:02 am UTC

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thandrak, 2009-08-27 10:47 am UTC

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bluefall, 2009-08-27 06:36 am UTC

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bluefall, 2009-08-27 07:45 am UTC

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arbre_rieur, 2009-08-27 07:57 am UTC

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bluefall, 2009-08-27 08:02 am UTC

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demonprawn, 2009-08-27 12:19 pm UTC

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starpiper, 2009-08-27 05:47 pm UTC

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jaybee3, 2009-08-27 06:03 am UTC

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box_in_the_box, 2009-08-27 05:49 pm UTC

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jaybee3, 2009-08-27 06:42 pm UTC

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zordboy, 2009-08-27 06:15 am UTC

	ex_menagerie993 2009-08-27 05:30 am UTC (link)
	What do you think he's doing? (Hoping Obsidian isn't the bad guy again here myself). (Reply to this) (Thread)

	skylands 2009-08-27 05:35 am UTC (link)
	Me too. I have two theories on what I hope he's not doing: 1. Splitting the team on the basis of political standings. 2. Giving Magog any form of actual page time. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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zordboy, 2009-08-27 05:37 am UTC

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ex_menagerie993, 2009-08-27 05:38 am UTC

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fromtheaether, 2009-08-27 10:23 am UTC

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zordboy, 2009-08-27 12:35 pm UTC

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volksjager, 2009-08-27 01:28 pm UTC

ian_karkull
2009-08-27 05:33 am UTC (link)

Hahaha, they're treating Magog like he's an actual, serious character and not some horrible abortion. That is too funny!
Seriously though, you do not talk to Wildcat like that. All that will get you is broken bones.

Also, it's very nice of you to spell you're plot out to us like that, Mr. Willingham, but to be honest, it's fairly unimaginative, I think everybody has caught up so far.
Eh, who knows? If this brings about the return of Ian Karkull, i just might be a little bit more lenient.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	tacobob 2009-08-27 12:42 pm UTC (link)
	If I recall, wasn't Magog a collection of Liefieldish character bits that Alex Ross HATED. He was trying to make a point. Don't think DC got it. >:\| (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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starwolf_oakley, 2009-08-27 03:02 pm UTC

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kd_the_movie, 2009-08-28 08:55 am UTC

	xdoop 2009-08-27 05:42 am UTC (link)
	I'm hoping all those villains the JSA were fighting aren't real or something, because having someone like Eclipso act like some random mook is really OOC. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	First rule of Willingham: lacunatattoo 2009-08-27 02:17 pm UTC (link)
	He doesn't write ANYONE in character. In my experience, all his characters either a) whine/piss/moan/rant using terms like "dummy" and "crudface", or b) pontificate in excessive detail on tactics. These scans here are actually some of his better iterations. And that says a lot. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	arbre_rieur 2009-08-27 06:03 am UTC (link)
	Folks, this comic is co-written by Willingham AND Matthew Sturges. Why are people always talking about it as if Willingham was working on it solo? (Reply to this) (Thread)

	arbre_rieur 2009-08-27 06:07 am UTC (link)
	It seems to be a JSA thing. Back when Johns and Goyer were co-writing, people hardly ever brought up Goyer and often acted like Johns was the sole writer. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	ashtoreth 2009-08-27 06:08 am UTC (link)
	So you think Sturges slapped Willingham around and told him, "Don't gimme any grief, Willie! I know what readers like and we're doing it MY WAY!" (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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arbre_rieur, 2009-08-27 06:17 am UTC

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ashtoreth, 2009-08-27 06:25 am UTC

	bluefall 2009-08-27 06:37 am UTC (link)
	Well, it may have something to do with the dialog. It's hard to miss Willingham dialog. And hard to hear the story and not "Willingham is talking" when you see it. (Reply to this) (Parent) (Thread)

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oddpuppets, 2009-08-27 08:29 am UTC

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demonprawn, 2009-08-27 12:23 pm UTC

oddpuppets
2009-08-27 08:48 am UTC (link)

I...I don't know quite what to say.

Let's ignore the apparent Willinghamisms for the moment. These are ham-fisted rhetoric and stilted dialogue. I know people are talking about Sturges but you know a Willinghamism once you see one.

1. What the HELL is up with Karen saying 'combat operations'?
It's not like she has military background, and as for superheroes using military lingo...Superheroics has never been about fighting, but saving. Oh yeah, there will always be those goddamn awesome knock-em-out brawls, but the whole point of superheroes is to SAVE people. Wasn't that the whole point of KC in the first place? This might seem a small thing to worry about, but I really think this is something to watch out for. What with Marvel's SHRA, Wildstorm, and various other superhero books, there should be some worry that military concepts and language will insinuate themselves in superheroes. This is not a dig at the military but about remembering what superheroes are - saviors, not soldiers.

2. Are they seriously going for an ageist battle in the Justice Society of fuckin' America? Seriously? A title whose mainstays are the miraculously still alive original Flash, Wildcat, and Sentinel? All about family and legacy? Cutting back, yes, it isn't too bad an idea. Family squabbles and all that, legacies fighting off their past for a new future. We could be looking at a stale but always fun, completely familial storyline. Except they have MAGOG leading it. Which is such a big no-no that I can't even say it with a calm voice.

3. SUPERHEROICS IS AND NEVER WILL BE MILITARY ACTION. SAVING, NOT WARRING.
The fact that Magog even threw that line about 3 years in the Marines is an absolute joke. I mean, Courtney has more experience with Superheroing than he does. She's faced greater challenges and saved more lives than this wreck of a character. She wields rank over him. U.S. combat operations is nothing like what a superhero needs. The best analogies would be emergency aid agencies, rescue operations, at the most extreme violent angle, perhaps counter-terrorism ops.
Yes, I understand that this is Willingham (and Sturges) setting up a point for their knockdown fight but the fact that Magog gets this voice of experience when there are far more compelling and, importantly, experienced superheroes in the JSA pisses the hell out of me. Courtney should be representing the young guns.
Where's Doctor Mid-Nite, with his moral objections?

I'm also slightly afraid that, as a former(?) operational head of Checkmate, Willingham (and Sturges) will cast Mr. Terrific on Magog's side, which would be a bloody mistake and off-character.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

daso
2009-08-27 10:39 am UTC (link)

1. What the HELL is up with Karen saying 'combat operations'?
It's consistent with how Willingham wrote Power Girl in the dull and pointless "DCU: Decisions" miniseries so I think you have to roll with that as long as he is on the book.
It should be noted that this tension in the team is building towards the launch of the new splinter book called... JSA All-Stars or something like that, headed by Magog.

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daningram, 2009-08-27 12:42 pm UTC

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lacunatattoo, 2009-08-27 02:18 pm UTC

shadeedge
2009-08-27 10:16 am UTC (link)

Eh, Magog sort of has something of a point - problem is that your average marine isn't Superman. Soldiering tactics are based around a unit of similar people, one or two of those perhaps having a useful additional ability. Superheroic teams like the JSA are filled with people of varying abilties, powers, and usefulness, a lot of whom are going to be acting in very different ways. On these pages, we've got Peej, Wildcat, Stargirl, Magog - all of their strengths lie in different areas. The closest you can come to some kind of unit tactics is simply having everyone focus on their own particular skills, meshing occasionally when useful - which, shock, is what they already do.

Saying marine experience qualifies one to be a superhero, even qualifies one as superior to many years of actual superheroics, is like saying martial arts training qualifies one to drive a tank. It's an entirely different type of fighting - when it is fighting, that is.

(Reply to this)

runespoor7
2009-08-27 11:47 am UTC (link)

In order to say the JSA should be more like the military, they should first start reconsider the candidates they let in. Superheroing, especially in teams, is based on the concept of "we the group need this person" or "this person, with their skills and maturity, has reached the stage where they can be useful/deserve to be a part of the group". Superheroing is by definition for people out of the norm. The military is the exact reverse, it's about any citizen physically fit for it having the right or the duty to serve and defend their country.

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daningram, 2009-08-27 12:41 pm UTC

	scottyquick 2009-08-27 01:33 pm UTC (link)
	Oh, Willingham. How I loathe you on superhero comics. Also, I don't like how the art treats Karen. She looks too much like "generic comic book superheroine body". I think she should bigger. (Reply to this) (Thread)

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kingrockwell, 2009-08-27 09:54 pm UTC

	comicoz 2009-08-27 02:52 pm UTC (link)
	It's a shame this series was cancelled before they could do that horrible Gog arc and continue to have horrible storylines past there. It did too stop, any issues you may have seen since then are works of your imagination, trust me on this. (Reply to this)

	shanejayell 2009-08-27 03:33 pm UTC (link)
	BLEH I am SO glad I dropped this book. (Reply to this)

	brandiweed.livejournal.com 2009-08-27 04:09 pm UTC (link)
	Not moved by this at all, but does anyone else here "Oh, you hear that? He's a MARINE! What did you serve, THREE YEARS? Some of us had already put in a lifetime of service to this country by the time you were still in diapers" in R. Lee Ermey's voice? (Reply to this)

	mullon 2009-08-27 04:51 pm UTC (link)
	Wait, when did Magog get on the team? (Reply to this) (Thread)

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volksjager, 2009-08-27 05:42 pm UTC